Ableton Forum

Ah. But everybody is missing one big fact here.
Operator wasn't the only device that received updated filters.
Operator and Simpler received new filter types.
Sampler has them too, but there are also morph filter types.

The only thing new to the operator, are the 2 added algorithms.
If you want to make an argument about how having that in Live 5 would enhance your experience... Then you have a pretty short battle on your hands.
If you think 2 algo's make operator sound better, imagine what adding another operator does

Racks are totally worth the upgrade. Many people have done some pretty incredible things with racks.
Whatever keeps you from upgrading, be it stability, saving money, lack of interest,...
Nothing is a match for the inspiration you get, once you grasped the flexibility of racks.

Case and point http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=54296

[quote="hoffman2k"]Ah. But everybody is missing one big fact here.
Operator wasn't the only device that received updated filters.
Operator and Simpler received new filter types.
Sampler has them too, but there are also morph filter types.

The only thing new to the operator, are the 2 added algorithms.
If you want to make an argument about how having that in Live 5 would enhance your experience... Then you have a pretty short battle on your hands.
If you think 2 algo's make operator sound better, imagine what adding another operator does

Racks are totally worth the upgrade. Many people have done some pretty incredible things with racks.
Whatever keeps you from upgrading, be it stability, saving money, lack of interest,...
Nothing is a match for the inspiration you get, once you grasped the flexibility of racks.

Case and point http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=54296[/quote]

Sorry, I am not talking about Live 6 but about Operator - which is sold separately. So I could not care less about Live6 features.

Principally Operator is sold as a separate product and it is listed as a separate product on the website. So giving a free update to Live6 users and not to Live5 users is bad customer relationship management. That is what Ableton is doing.
I mean if Cubase would say - Cubase4 get free update to HAL4 and virtual guitarist 3 - I would like to hear the people - but if Ableton does that, it is ok?

I think most Operator users paid about the same - so why are they treated differently? I see no reason.

The propability that the same happens with Sampler is pretty high - so it is generally forcing customers into updates, which seems quite unreasonable business praxis.

Regarding racks - well, principally they are great - but as a lot in Live since version 4 only implemented partly - racks start to make sense when there are send modules, etc. then it gets really interesting .... Maybe they implement it some day, then I will be interested in racks .....

best

I do think the upgrade path argument is pretty valid. If Operator is a separate product, then older users should get the same treatment. Perhaps with new version, as new features get added, Abes could offer a patch for older users and charge an upgrade fee?

hoffman2k wrote:Case and point

I think you mean 'case in point' ...

...and thats a sweet muthafuckin link!