Is EQ8 a linear phase equalizer?

[Angstrom]

In Live 9 EQEight is linear phase.

EQ Eight was programed for Live 9 by Cytomic. https://cytomic.com/ableton-and-cytomic
Cytomic also added his Glue compressor to Live 9 and in Live 9.5 he added to the filters with optimized versions from The Drop.



"The new algorithm for EQ 8 is an analog model of a linear SVF circuit, and as such shares the excellent noise performance, as well as ultra smooth modulation properties, of the ideal circuit. The cutoff of EQ 8 can be swept smoothly with automation without the horrible artefacts of commonly used EQ algorithms."


Andrew Simpler on EQ Eight https://www.ableton.com/en/blog/andrew- ... -eq-eight/

The Drop filters added to Live 9.5 https://www.ableton.com/en/live/new-in-9-5/

Hmm, I'm not too sure about that you know. I think Andrew is refering to linear DRIVE rather than linear phase. In a non-linear drive we get saturation effects, harmonic additions (often pleasant) so his model is transparent in drive in that it add no harmonics. Linear phase of course relates to something different altogether.

I did have a link of him explaining the difference and clarifying but I'm mobile now and cannae find it at the mo.

[Stromkraft]

And yes for the 1,000,000th time EQ8 is not linear phase.

Exactly.

[Stromkraft]

I think Andrew is refering to linear DRIVE rather than linear phase. In a non-linear drive we get saturation effects, harmonic additions (often pleasant) so his model is transparent in drive in that it add no harmonics. Linear phase of course relates to something different altogether.

Angstrom is of course correct.

[fishmonkey]

a linear phase EQ isn't inherently superior to a minimum phase one. it all depends on what you are trying to achieve, each has their drawbacks.

apart from the added latency, another significant characteristic of linear phase EQs is that they cause pre-ringing artifacts, which tend to soften transients. minimum phase EQs have post-ringing but this tends to be masked by the signal itself.

[Tarekith]

Agreed. It's a VERY rare day here in the mastering studio that I reach for a linear phase EQ over minimum phase. Bit of a myth that they are better in mastering, or better than normal EQs.

[BenFalb]

Hi all
I also doubt that EQ8 is a linear phase equalizer. And here is the reason:
LIVE was also designed to work in a live environment that demands for low latency. So the EQ8 is a reasonable well designed filter bank that gives the option for sharp and parameterized filter flanks without any or much latency and clicking. This comes with a cost and that is phase distortion. Linear phase equalizer however always have the following tradeoff: "Sharp filter flanks vs. low latency" or "The steeper the filter flanks the higher the latency".
The EQ8 has options to boost or cut certain frequencies by +/- 15dB or highpass or lowpass by around 48dB/octave!! Realizing such with an linear phase eq will result in a latency of many many milliseconds, BUT what you get is no phase distortion (sometimes referred as linear-phase).
The reason for higher latency is not the high processing demand, but the way linear-phase equalization is realized in the digital domain (lots of maths background is required here to explain this so I keep it short for sake of simplicity)
It's sad that in LIVE does not come with a linear-phase eq since many users use LIVE as a music production or mixing tool, where latency is not always the issue.
BR

[fishmonkey]

necrobump!

one situation where a linear phase EQ can be a better choice than a minimum phase EQ is when you are applying the EQ to only one side of a parallel-processing chain...