OT: Zoloft and anxiety/panic attacks

[nuxnamon]

my attitude is that psychotropics are wonderful tools that have the ability to short-circuit your consciousness into different mental/emotional/spiritual states that your are already, in some latent way, capable of experiencing...

however, they also need to be treated with great respect for this ability, and not taken for granted...

when you get to the stage that you are hammering the same drug over and over, and not learning anything from the experience, you are in a pointless loop...

in one of the Carlos Castaneda books (can't remember which one), Carlos is asking Don Juan why he has to trip on Ayahuasca so often, whilst another student (who is progressing very well) has only tripped once... and Don Juan says something along the lines of "because you are stubborn and stupid"...

This is very true. Ram dass came to the same conclusion while timothy leary kept going....... Ram dass said that hallucinogenic are a great way to experience the divine, but once you experience it, the only way to maintain that relationship is through meditation and consciousness.......
The problem with weed (imho) is that my generation (gen x) was not taught to respect it, but that it could be used as a harmless crutch. SO while I read all the same don juan, dan millman, jung, tao of physics, Terence McKenna, joseph campbell, and other mystical books, I was reading them stoned and not respecting them. I guess I was reading for the knowledge, not the wisdom

i can't believe we have similar book libraries..
here's my thing w/ weed.. I was a moderate smoker for close to 5 years.. always good experiences and never had any problems.. but once i got that first major panic attack that sent me to the hospital, the doc said immediately it;s the weed, the coffee, the alcohol, etc.... I'm thinking i've been smoking for years and now it affects me.. another doc said it was the breakup.. since then, i haven't smoke weed as a precaution (coming to 3 years now) and i really do wonder if i can smoke occasionally again.. maybe it's ironic and maybe a sign but this is my 420th post.. hella fuc^&* yeah.. if you got some, wish me a happy 420 and smoke a fatty for me please.. i miss that feeling of smoking a bud and just getting lost in music..

[aisling]

my attitude is that psychotropics are wonderful tools that have the ability to short-circuit your consciousness into different mental/emotional/spiritual states that your are already, in some latent way, capable of experiencing...

however, they also need to be treated with great respect for this ability, and not taken for granted...

when you get to the stage that you are hammering the same drug over and over, and not learning anything from the experience, you are in a pointless loop...

in one of the Carlos Castaneda books (can't remember which one), Carlos is asking Don Juan why he has to trip on Ayahuasca so often, whilst another student (who is progressing very well) has only tripped once... and Don Juan says something along the lines of "because you are stubborn and stupid"...

This is very true. Ram dass came to the same conclusion while timothy leary kept going....... Ram dass said that hallucinogenic are a great way to experience the divine, but once you experience it, the only way to maintain that relationship is through meditation and consciousness.......
The problem with weed (imho) is that my generation (gen x) was not taught to respect it, but that it could be used as a harmless crutch. SO while I read all the same don juan, dan millman, jung, tao of physics, Terence McKenna, joseph campbell, and other mystical books, I was reading them stoned and not respecting them. I guess I was reading for the knowledge, not the wisdom

i can't believe we have similar book libraries..
here's my thing w/ weed.. I was a moderate smoker for close to 5 years.. always good experiences and never had any problems.. but once i got that first major panic attack that sent me to the hospital, the doc said immediately it;s the weed, the coffee, the alcohol, etc.... I'm thinking i've been smoking for years and now it affects me.. another doc said it was the breakup.. since then, i haven't smoke weed as a precaution (coming to 3 years now) and i really do wonder if i can smoke occasionally again.. maybe it's ironic and maybe a sign but this is my 420th post.. hella fuc^&* yeah.. if you got some, wish me a happy 420 and smoke a fatty for me please.. i miss that feeling of smoking a bud and just getting lost in music..

Congrats on the post count. I agree about getting lost in the music with a nice tasty bud. That fantasy is so vivid. I can't any more for similar reasons. Coffee is my next big vice. I am a 3 a day cupper, french press (with cardamon added) only, none of that diner drip shit. I know it affects me negatively. But like all my prior vices, my ego does anything and everything to rationalize continued use. My new rationalization is reading all the "health benefits" of coffee, how it burns fat, wards off type 2 diabetes, delays Alzheimer's....

Cool stuff on the library, there are quite a few others I have come across on the board who share similar interests.....

[stapum]

Guys everyone now and then must have been depressed... everyone has been left by some girlfriend and most likely been depressed and felt bad, but to be honest i dont think thats a reason to start taking pharmaceutical drugs... it's all in your mind, so with time it goes away and you dont have to take drugs for it to desapear, you just have to go trought the rough fase and learn from it...

pharmaceutical companys must be very thankfull with all the break ups going on in USA as people use them to get over their problems!!! thats really weird!!!

I would suggest spending more time with friends and actually talking to them and say what you're going trough... it helps a lot compared to using drugs! but if you really want to take drugs use them recreationaly!! smoke a joint or take an E, it will make you no harm if you do it once in a while...

now panic attacks??? Jesus!! who made you believe in that crap?!!! Its all in your mind!! dont take life to serious, enjoy it be happy even if you're going to a rough fase... play like when you were young... make a beat, have a glass of wine... just enjoy life, dont waste it feeling bad...

[twisted-space]

I guess I was reading for the knowledge, not the wisdom

I've recently started to understand, the older I get the easier it becomes to recognise wisdom when I see it (but not necessarily to follow it, I hope this will come in time).

[alex.the.forge]

Guys everyone now and then must have been depressed... everyone has been left by some girlfriend and most likely been depressed and felt bad, but to be honest i dont think thats a reason to start taking pharmaceutical drugs... it's all in your mind, so with time it goes away and you dont have to take drugs for it to desapear, you just have to go trought the rough fase and learn from it...

pharmaceutical companys must be very thankfull with all the break ups going on in USA as people use them to get over their problems!!! thats really weird!!!

I would suggest spending more time with friends and actually talking to them and say what you're going trough... it helps a lot compared to using drugs! but if you really want to take drugs use them recreationaly!! smoke a joint or take an E, it will make you no harm if you do it once in a while...

now panic attacks??? Jesus!! who made you believe in that crap?!!! Its all in your mind!! dont take life to serious, enjoy it be happy even if you're going to a rough fase... play like when you were young... make a beat, have a glass of wine... just enjoy life, dont waste it feeling bad...

what you're basically saying is you feel all right, so everyone else is just imagining it.

It's not so easy for everyone dude.

[robfoster]

now panic attacks??? Jesus!! who made you believe in that crap?!!! Its all in your mind!! dont take life to serious, enjoy it be happy even if you're going to a rough fase... play like when you were young... make a beat, have a glass of wine... just enjoy life, dont waste it feeling bad...

If you'd ever had one you wouldn't be making such a misinformed statement.

Yes mental illness is all in the mind, try telling that to a paranoid schizophrenic.

[UnCL0NED]

Heavy stuff for such a "harmless" forum...

When it comes to panic attacks everybody always seems to know what's best for you! "It's all in your head! Just think positive thoughts and everything will be alright!"

I'm NOT a psychiatrist or anything. But maybe this will help you:
I know it's different for everybody but I used to have panic attacks for about a year. I wouldn't drive at night anymore or go anywhere without my mobile phone, etc...

The thing that turned me around was comming to realize that anxiety and panic are psychological issues that can be cured completely. Don't let drugs cloud your mind. Confront your fears! Don't avoid things that you fear. This will only make your fears "real". It's through experience that we learn. Learning is really realizing that there is nothing to fear. Also, deal with issues from the past.

I know that's all easier said than done. And you probably won't be able to do it all by yourself. Get professional help (not drugs or alcohol = running away from your fears) and maybe a book like this can help: "Panic Attacks Workbook: A Guided Program for Beating the Panic Trick" by David Carbonell. <- it helped me a lot!

I know it's possible and liberating to be completly free of anxiety and panic attacks. Good luck with everything!

[stapum]

what you're basically saying is you feel all right, so everyone else is just imagining it.

It's not so easy for everyone dude.

It has not always been easy i've been cheated by the only person i really loved, and yes it was f*cking hard time for me and i thought i was going crazy, really... i was getting lots of paranoid thoughts and stuff...but eventualy it all started to fade away and today i'm ok... i was just trying to say that you should avoid taking farmaceuticals even if you're depressed... hold on to good things like family and friends, music, pets... these are all things that make you feel better...

I did'n mean to offend anyone, i was just trying to give you guys a different point of view with a little hope and positive thinking on it... sometimes we just have to simplify complex stuff that we unfortunately tend to make even more complex... i'm sorry if i said something that might hurt anyone's feelings, that was not my intention... stay cool

[aisling]

but if you really want to take drugs use them recreationaly!! smoke a joint or take an E, it will make you no harm if you do it once in a while...

I'd agree on the joint thing for most. I'd rather encourage that over the E. From my understanding E is VERY bad news, it can permanently alter neurotransmitter transmission between synapses. There are MANY studies linking E use to mental illness later. It seems to effect women a little more than men, but still does damage to males. (yes I have done my share of E in the past)

As far as my drugs go, I always felt if nature grew it, cool...But if man has to synthesize it, caution! Many of the labs making it these days are using alternative chemicals, you're not getting MDMA like in the 60's-70's....your getting designer speed

[DrXparaMental]

what you're basically saying is you feel all right, so everyone else is just imagining it.

It's not so easy for everyone dude.

It has not always been easy i've been cheated by the only person i really loved, and yes it was f*cking hard time for me and i thought i was going crazy, really... i was getting lots of paranoid thoughts and stuff...but eventualy it all started to fade away and today i'm ok... i was just trying to say that you should avoid taking farmaceuticals even if you're depressed... hold on to good things like family and friends, music, pets... these are all things that make you feel better...

I did'n mean to offend anyone, i was just trying to give you guys a different point of view with a little hope and positive thinking on it... sometimes we just have to simplify complex stuff that we unfortunately tend to make even more complex... i'm sorry if i said something that might hurt anyone's feelings, that was not my intention... stay cool

You're fine Stapum. I am CERTAIN no one will hold it against you. Panic attacks are very serious and traumatic affairs. Unfortunately sometimes drugs are the only option. I agree with you and seriously doubt anyone would not, that IF you can deal successfully without drugs, that's always the best route to take. But truth is that many mental illnesses are in fact biochemical in nature and right now, that's the scientific means available to treat many of these horrifying ailments.

[robfoster]

what you're basically saying is you feel all right, so everyone else is just imagining it.

It's not so easy for everyone dude.

It has not always been easy i've been cheated by the only person i really loved, and yes it was f*cking hard time for me and i thought i was going crazy, really... i was getting lots of paranoid thoughts and stuff...but eventualy it all started to fade away and today i'm ok... i was just trying to say that you should avoid taking farmaceuticals even if you're depressed... hold on to good things like family and friends, music, pets... these are all things that make you feel better...

I did'n mean to offend anyone, i was just trying to give you guys a different point of view with a little hope and positive thinking on it... sometimes we just have to simplify complex stuff that we unfortunately tend to make even more complex... i'm sorry if i said something that might hurt anyone's feelings, that was not my intention... stay cool

[alex.the.forge]

what you're basically saying is you feel all right, so everyone else is just imagining it.

It's not so easy for everyone dude.

It has not always been easy i've been cheated by the only person i really loved, and yes it was f*cking hard time for me and i thought i was going crazy, really... i was getting lots of paranoid thoughts and stuff...but eventualy it all started to fade away and today i'm ok... i was just trying to say that you should avoid taking farmaceuticals even if you're depressed... hold on to good things like family and friends, music, pets... these are all things that make you feel better...

I did'n mean to offend anyone, i was just trying to give you guys a different point of view with a little hope and positive thinking on it... sometimes we just have to simplify complex stuff that we unfortunately tend to make even more complex... i'm sorry if i said something that might hurt anyone's feelings, that was not my intention... stay cool

for many that may be true, but for some things don't work so smoothly

just like some people are born with asthma or whatever, some people have brain chemistry that is different to the majority and it makes it just that little bit harder to live a normal life

some people have the confidence to go out and make their mark and do anything, others feel it is an achievement just to make it out of the door into the outside world

everyone is different and I know you meant know harm as you simply don't empathise because you don't experience these kind of problems, but would you say to an asthmatic "it's okay, it's all in the lungs, just breathe in and out"?

in the old days people with mental health issues would either be institutionalised, outcast, maybe just end up alcoholic/homeless etc etc

these days we have treatment that allows people, who might otherwise struggle, to lead a relatively normal life

the downside to that may be that doctors are sometimes a bit too eager to hand them out, but actually we are really lucky that we live in a society where you can go to somebody and say you don't feel right and they can actually help you

[robfoster]

Going back to the weed thing, these days its far too strong, people are smoking it much younger, its little wonder there are so many fucked up people out there.

Anyway on that note, have a great weekend

[MidiMonk]

Guys everyone now and then must have been depressed... everyone has been left by some girlfriend and most likely been depressed and felt bad, but to be honest i dont think thats a reason to start taking pharmaceutical drugs... it's all in your mind, so with time it goes away and you dont have to take drugs for it to desapear, you just have to go trought the rough fase and learn from it...

pharmaceutical companys must be very thankfull with all the break ups going on in USA as people use them to get over their problems!!! thats really weird!!!

I would suggest spending more time with friends and actually talking to them and say what you're going trough... it helps a lot compared to using drugs! but if you really want to take drugs use them recreationaly!! smoke a joint or take an E, it will make you no harm if you do it once in a while...

now panic attacks??? Jesus!! who made you believe in that crap?!!! Its all in your mind!! dont take life to serious, enjoy it be happy even if you're going to a rough fase... play like when you were young... make a beat, have a glass of wine... just enjoy life, dont waste it feeling bad...

While I despise meds(the RX companies mainly), they do have a purpose when no other options work on their own.A balanced course of treatment is key, it takes years too.That "its all in your mind" theory does more harm than good(somewhat insulting too) and then you go on saying smoke some weed or takes some "E".Uh, you have no clue I see when it comes to mental illness--drugs are a big no no.Back to panic attacks, a really good non drug technique to use is Cognitive Behavioral Therapy.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_ ... al_therapy

[importedearthman]

now panic attacks??? Jesus!! who made you believe in that crap?!!! Its all in your mind!! dont take life to serious, enjoy it be happy even if you're going to a rough fase... play like when you were young... make a beat, have a glass of wine... just enjoy life, dont waste it feeling bad...

If you'd ever had one you wouldn't be making such a misinformed statement.

Yes mental illness is all in the mind, try telling that to a paranoid schizophrenic.

Paranoid schizophrenic is redundant no? (been there) I couldn't agree more. Stapum hasn't experienced his "bad trip" yet. Here's a story for you Stapum its a good explanation of what its like.

**WARNING** if you are prone to flashbacks or "panic attacks" or :bad trip" whatever you want to label them, you might not want watch this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbCxnXdRfVE

I posted my bad trip a couple pages ago. I still flash and go back "there" and it's not good. It's all in your mind... this is where you're correct to a point dood. Because until you lose control of your own mind Stapum, you have NO IDEA how BAD it can GET. This guy telling this story is lucky because he 'came back'. Some people never make it 'back' I was hella lucky I came back. But the trip haunts me a lot like John Nash's imaginary friends haunt him.

I still have "panic attacks" or "flashbacks" or again... whatever you want to call them but I have them a little more under control now. I don't *ALWAYS* end up naked in the street being arrested by cops and thrown in the looney bin section of the downtown hospital.