What makes EQ plugins better than lives EQ8?

[nebulae]

If interested in color, look into Voxengo's Gliss EQ and HarmoniEQ. Both are now cross platform.

[Ill Frequencies]

Some EQ are more transparent than others.
So yea if you want transparent EQ, Ableton Live one is fine I guess.

If you want to use an EQ with colour (SSL Waves EQ for example) use 3rd party.

What exactly do the terms "transparent" and "colour" mean when referring to EQ?
Always hear people saying it but no idea what it means.

[Rave]

Fabfilter pro-q is my go to. I use it on any track that needs shaping. I love it. It is easy to dial in changes so u can concentrate on the music. Fabfilters limiter is amazing too, tis much better than the one in isotope ozone 4 which I also own but have stopped using. I do plan on getting gliss too to add colour.

[Tympanic]

Hi there,

fantastic plugins eqwise with even more sound come from ddmf.
This one LINK is great freeware!

And THIS one is just
what you want.


cheers

[Tarekith]

What exactly do the terms "transparent" and "colour" mean when referring to EQ?
Always hear people saying it but no idea what it means.

Some EQs are very good at boosting or cutting frequencies in a way that doesn't add anything else to the signal, they are transparent. Some EQs can make things sound warmer/duller/harsher/brighter even when you're not doing mush boosting or cutting. These terms are more or less what people mean by color.

For instance, I know the Sonalksis SV517 plug in will ever so slightly attentuate the highs when I use it, compared to eQuality which lets the high end through
so it sounds just like the original file. Therefore eQuality is more transparent, the plug in isn't adding anything other than the boost I want.

A lot of this is on purpose, how the manufacturer designs the phase adjustment of the frequencies you're EQing, if they use oversampling, linear phase, minimum phase, etc. Not to mention how they implement things like bell shapes, filtering and the like.

Simple answer is that transparent tools don't affect the audio anymore than they have to, and colored tools have different 'flavors' built in on purpose.

[Machinesworking]

I've got a ton of Eq's mostly they do sound the same, the vintage emulations don't at all, the Nomad Puls Teq, Retro Music and Film tone and British EQ all sound different.
There are about 6 other Nomad Eq's that sound the same though, and the real clincher is Digital Performers Masterworks EQ, it's got both vintage modeling and clinical built in, plus the live waveform is very useful. I still use the Ableton EQ though for live use especially, built ins main advantage is stability. If I was rich I would buy the Masterworks Collection from MOTU just for the MW EQ though, the interface is perfect IMO.

[kev herb]

has any body tried the new Waves H EQ yet as its $99 at the moment as an introduction price and im sure it has different emulation modes will demo it myself but thought id ask if anybody was already using it? like the look of the asymetrical bell filters and choosing frequency by piano key.

[Evengy]

Why do people like to go 3rd party and get an EQ plugin instead of using Lives built in one?

because of g.a.s., especially beginners think that they need a thousand dollar eq to sound like they ideal and to show other people that they have superEQ²³ from nativewavefluxsuperplugins. i had the same problem and after trying ~20-30 eqs i deleted all and im using live eq only. i miss nothing!

i never needed a colouring eq because everything what i do with a signal like effects etc. it will change the signal too. it is colouring for me....

use the eq which is more fun to use for you. nice gui, offering different slopes etc. so buy it if it fits you very well but not because of thinking that you sound like superstar xyz with another needless eq. i only need ableton eq and i think that you can get the same result with all bread & butter eq´s.

[be tonal]

But I hope you are aware that stacking two 24dB/oct Filters with the same cutoff is NOT the same as having a 48dB/oct from the start. This should already be clear when thinking about the cutoff-frequency:
All (or better most, because its a definition thing) have the cutoff-frequency (the one you will set up on the EQ panel or GUI) damped already by -3dB: You might have noticed by using EQ8 (EQuate), the filter already rolls of there. So what if you add 2 of them? You will have of course 48dB/oct steepness, but also 2 x -3dB = -6dB at the cutoff-frequency, right? But an REAL 48dB/oct cut filter you will have -3dB at the cutoff-frequency.
You could compensate with the Q-control oder another bell-shaped band maybe, but I am sure, phase is also acting different, but have no evidence, as I am no expert in filter design.

I ONLY use EQ8 atm, but also want more filter types (steeper ones) and spectrum.

Mentioned here:
http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php? ... 8&start=15

Afaik all analogue filters start as 6db/oct filters and achieve higher Q by stacking them.
There´s always attenuation at the filter frequency (with no resonance) as 48db/oct just means "48db attenuation at 1 octave below the cutoff", at least with all filters i´ve worked with so far. What the sonalksis does differently i dont know, i´m happy with stacking bands on the Eq8. Don´t be fooled by graphic curve representation, let your ears judge (i know it gets old, but it´s true!). On a similar tip: If you want to get better at mixing, don´t rely too much on the analyzers. You don´t want to make your mix look good, it should sound good.
Eq8 too clean? I like to use just a hint of Ableton´s distortion and/or saturation for colour . That´s btw how many of the 'vintage sound' eqs work, just usual eq plus subtle saturation/distotion.

And for linear phase: It always introduces latency, so i wouldn´t bother about it unless for mastering.

Now go make some music!

[Ill Frequencies]

What exactly do the terms "transparent" and "colour" mean when referring to EQ?
Always hear people saying it but no idea what it means.

Some EQs are very good at boosting or cutting frequencies in a way that doesn't add anything else to the signal, they are transparent. Some EQs can make things sound warmer/duller/harsher/brighter even when you're not doing mush boosting or cutting. These terms are more or less what people mean by color.

For instance, I know the Sonalksis SV517 plug in will ever so slightly attentuate the highs when I use it, compared to eQuality which lets the high end through
so it sounds just like the original file. Therefore eQuality is more transparent, the plug in isn't adding anything other than the boost I want.

A lot of this is on purpose, how the manufacturer designs the phase adjustment of the frequencies you're EQing, if they use oversampling, linear phase, minimum phase, etc. Not to mention how they implement things like bell shapes, filtering and the like.

Simple answer is that transparent tools don't affect the audio anymore than they have to, and colored tools have different 'flavors' built in on purpose.

Sweet thanks for that, always helpful. Now I know what people are talking about!
Do you have any recommendations for a 3rd party EQ for producing?
Another question a bit off topic but do you have a certain way of splitting up the frequencies (low, mid and high)?

[Khazul]

For most jobs EQ8 will be absolutely fine eithger in normal or HQ mode and is the EQ I use the most, however TBH I tend to be a bit careful with it and avoid slopes that are to steep in the mid range as not keen on the result in such circumstances. It tends to be the EQ of choice for building cross overs or multi-band processing racks in Live (use it in normal mode for this). UI wise - its quick and simple to use and has an M/S mode which I use alot.

So of the other EQs I use, fabfilter pro-Q is the one I choose when I need drastic corrections and use it as a mix EQ. I just think it sounds a litttle sweeter with steep curves etc. I like its use and monitoring etc and that it has a spectrum display in it. It tends to be my choice for post-mix.

Others I like purely for character: red-line EQ - lots of options and dynamics etc.
Any good simulation of E/G series SSL console EQs with filters.

The only headache with these is that these days I have got so used to a good visual representation of the curve that purely tweaking and listening feels odd (even if once it was all I ever used). On the plus siude, I still think you get better results with a good sweet console sounding EQ when you have to just listen and not watch even if it takes longer. I tend to find that once satified with initial tweaking then it tends to stick, whereas many visual EQs I end up going back to them and tweaking later.

[Khazul]

Another question a bit off topic but do you have a certain way of splitting up the frequencies (low, mid and high)?

Are you wanting no color (or as little color added as possible) after the frequencies have been split? If you're EQing already and don't mind a little color, then there's really no reason AFAIK to be exact about it. Just take an Audio Effect Rack and create three chains in it - one will be the Low, the second will be the Mid, the third the High. For the low, just use a low pass filter. For the high, use a high pass filter. For the mids, either use a bandpass filter (harder to control) or both a low pass and a high pass filter.

If you want to avoid color - make sure the Q is set to 0.5 is less.

[Tarekith]

And for linear phase: It always introduces latency, so i wouldn´t bother about it unless for mastering.

You'd be surprised how few mastering engineers use linear eqs actually.

[Khazul]

And for linear phase: It always introduces latency, so i wouldn´t bother about it unless for mastering.

You'd be surprised how few mastering engineers use linear eqs actually.

Well given that about the most audible difference (ignoring specific filter character) tends to be on transients it probably doesn't matter at all when the result is only going to get smashed by a limiter

[Tarekith]

It's the opposite IMO. When you start smearing transients, there's less you can do with a limiter to get volume boosts as cleanly. Or rather, with smeared transients, the effects of heavy limiting can be more audible.