Ableton Forum

What do ex-PM Margaret Thatcher and ex-DJ Jimmy Savile have in common. (Apart from the fact everyone is pleased they are dead, obviously)

They both fucked miners.

andydes wrote:

LoopStationZebra wrote:And I'm saying that 'sensible' to the Left = Unfettered Socialism.

Oh, come on. I've managed to coax a decent discussion out of you before. I know you've got more to say. But you do like your cheap shots. Like when any American says anything a bit lefty you have to wade in with a

"drones, zomg. "

At least try to keep it original.

I am original.
But I agree, lately I've been feeling lazy.

Machinesworking wrote:

LoopStationZebra wrote:And I'm saying that 'sensible' to the Left = Unfettered Socialism.

And sensible to the right is unfettered capitalism.
Both IMO leed to tyranny, depends on what kind of tyranny you want...

Both are guilty of allowing for total state control, IE the Soviet republic and Nazi reign.

IMO privatizing public works like electricity has been proven to be a mistake ala Enron.
The main problem with both private and public control of necessities of life is accountability, there isn't much if any.
We protect our new autocrats whether they come from corporations or governments, because they own the government, and we're well taken care of pets.

Well said, as usual.


By the early 70s there was seemingly nothing that Labour didn't want public. It wasn't just the utilities and NHS and garbagemen and transit and schools. It was a vast, growing list that pretty much named any manual labour job you can think of.. This manifested itself, really, in the form of Unions. Not necessary private Unions with oversight, but STATE run Unions on a massive scale.

The problem?

The country was already broke. Suddenly you're looking at a vast increase in very expensive things like pensions for thousands upon thousands more workers, with absolutely no hard currency/income to back that up.

The mining issue in Britain is the biggest fiasco of all. Way, way, WAY before Thatcher - early 60s - the mining industry was on the decline.

Because...uh...there wasn't much left to mine.

Labour essentially wanted to keep production going strong and everyone employed; when all that really amounted to was the same amount of workers pulling out half the coal that had been seen in the past.

Lefties want to pretend that Thatcher simply eliminated mining in the UK, but the fact remains it was a totally dying industry. Did Labour make any attempt to re-educate and re-assign miners to other careers prior to Thatcher? They absolutely did not. ffs.

Ding Dong Motherfucker.

https://soundcloud.com/celebrity-murder ... -ding-dong

cmcpress wrote:Ding Dong Motherfucker.

https://soundcloud.com/celebrity-murder ... -ding-dong

https://witness.guardian.co.uk/assignme ... 87b/278535


Photos from other cities around England.
Grantham (Thatcher's home town)

London

Leeds

Bradford


LSZ, checkmate!

lol.

Wait, are those images of Thatcher's funeral services or the launch of a new Microsoft tablet?

same crowd I'm sure!

LoopStationZebra wrote:
Lefties want to pretend that Thatcher simply eliminated mining in the UK.

Yeah, and she stole my milk too.

You are largely right about all that. At the time, she did a lot that was probably necessary and some that maybe wasn't so great.

My issue isn't really with her, but with Thatcherism. The current mob just think "thatcher was great, lets do more of the same", with no regard for what's the right course for any given situation.

Osborne has been warned by the world bank, the IMF, the OBR (governments own financial advisors) and fuck knows who else, that cutting too much too quickly is preventing growth and leaving us in even more debt. Note none of these organisations are known for being a bunch of hippies.

So seeing his usually smug face crying at her funeral gives me an enormous sense of dread, that the Tories will now step up their efforts

Machinesworking wrote:IMO privatizing public works like electricity has been proven to be a mistake ala Enron.
The main problem with both private and public control of necessities of life is accountability, there isn't much if any.
We protect our new autocrats whether they come from corporations or governments, because they own the government, and we're well taken care of pets.

Private companies carrying out state imposed mandates is perhaps not the best example of the free market at play. If I wanted to make a case against caffeine in soft drinks, I wouldn't go after Sprite.

Meanwhile, in the world of DAWs, unfettered competition has given us everything from GarageBand iOS to Bitwig to Push. Show me one government innovation as pimp as return channels on Drum Racks and I'll donate my entire gun "collection" to Oxfam.

Jack McOck wrote:

Machinesworking wrote:IMO privatizing public works like electricity has been proven to be a mistake ala Enron.
The main problem with both private and public control of necessities of life is accountability, there isn't much if any.
We protect our new autocrats whether they come from corporations or governments, because they own the government, and we're well taken care of pets.

Private companies carrying out state imposed mandates is perhaps not the best example of the free market at play. If I wanted to make a case against caffeine in soft drinks, I wouldn't go after Sprite.

Meanwhile, in the world of DAWs, unfettered competition has given us everything from GarageBand iOS to Bitwig to Push. Show me one government innovation as pimp as return channels on Drum Racks and I'll donate my entire gun "collection" to Oxfam.

That's easy, nuclear weapons, stealth bombers, superhighways, bridge technology, computer technology, the internet, satellites, space missions, space stations, landing on the moon, the Curiosity rover currently on mars, laser weapons... I could go on, Not sure what Oxfam's going to do with your guns??

I love how folks on the right like to tout financial success as the highest of accomplishments while ignoring social policy (since they don't really give a shit how their neighbors doing as long as they've got a big t.v.) "Before Thatcher came along the economy was completely tanked!" I certainly can't think of any other situation in which bad policies were used to "good" effect like this. Oh, wait. Germany under the rule of Hitler. He crushed those dumb trade unions and set things right didn't he? Okay, okay. We can't really sit here and compare Maggie to Hitler though...

President Reagan is often touted as having given the American economy a huge boost yet national debt has done nothing but skyrocket since his terms in office. I won't talk about President Bill Clinton's "surplus" as it's a bit of smoke and mirrors but public debt was way down and since he left office debt has again skyrocketed under President Bush and now President Obama. Folks on the right are screaming about the debt under Obama but they just sat there all self satisfied as Bush made wild grammatical errors on national television but kept up the rhetoric of American Freedom. To be fair folks on the left are now sitting smugly as Obama compounds the fiscal problems Bush left us with.

^^
Puppet on the left, puppet on the right, it's the same guy pulling the strings.
A two party system is pretty much a one party system that argues with itself a bit.