i know u fanboys love this...

nebulae · Post by **nebulae** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:38 pm

aah, nice ones, lm....thanks for the specifics...now we can have a constructive conversation about it.

I'll start. Go fuck yourself. Retort?

sparklepuff · Post by **sparklepuff** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:39 pm

I'll be speaking for Mr. Muffin. Fuck YOU.

nebulae · Post by **nebulae** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:42 pm

oh yeah, mothefucker?

blank · Post by **blank** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:42 pm

sparklepuff wrote:As a guy who is so completely demanding of is DAW, DJ Itchy, how about you throw up a link to your tunes so we can all marvel at your magnificent songs that in no way could have been made using Live due to all of it's hindering limitations?

I admit I am curious too. I really don't see what live can't do that fl can.

nebulae · Post by **nebulae** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:44 pm

blank wrote:I admit I am curious too. I really don't see what live can't do that fl can.

I take it that you're drawing a blank?

blank · Post by **blank** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:48 pm

nebulae wrote:
blank wrote:I admit I am curious too. I really don't see what live can't do that fl can.
I take it that you're drawing a blank?

Uh ?

Martyn · Post by **Martyn** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:56 pm

nebulae wrote:^ Martyn, what shortcomings, exactly? because personally, having used every daw out there, there's only 1 issue I have with Live (have had for 4 versions now) - that the CPU usage sux, and that the graphics slows to a crawl with complex arrangemetns and sets. Other than that, I see zero drawbacks. Rather, there are so many ways to route audio, and so many creative things I can ONLY do in Live. My own personal opinion....not intended to fight - just curious about what drawbacks people really miss...

Well yeah, I still use it as my main DAW so obviously no show stoppers. All the ones you mention, add to that the lack of ability to set separate groove ammounts per clip (not just shuffle) and save quantise templates, set program change flags within a single midi clip, sysEX, (some people have old hardware) multiple channel info in one midifile, no midi offsets etc. I could go on and on about the midi.

A lot of gripes I had have been sorted (ish) with Live 7, the main one being the inability to display more than one automation lane and lack of sidechain facility. There's still no way to ghost copy clips in the arrange window, which might relieve the cpu issue if it was there.

For me the advantages FAR outweigh the disadvantages though, if i even try to use onother DAW for more than 20 mins I'm practically tearing what's left of my hair out in frustration.

I was just pointing out that it's definately not for everybody, kind of glad about it too if I'm honest.

Tone Deft · Post by **Tone Deft** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 7:00 pm

blank wrote:
sparklepuff wrote:As a guy who is so completely demanding of is DAW, DJ Itchy, how about you throw up a link to your tunes so we can all marvel at your magnificent songs that in no way could have been made using Live due to all of it's hindering limitations?
I admit I am curious too. I really don't see what live can't do that fl can.

groove templates. Live has that 'track 1 arrange view feature' which is almost close.

I've only watched FL being used, never tried it.

as a DJ tool for 'DJ'ritchie, how would FL compare?

nebulae · Post by **nebulae** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 7:12 pm

excellent points, martyn, thanks. (also, FU, but with *hugs*)

Martyn · Post by **Martyn** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 7:25 pm

nebulae wrote:(also, FU, but with *hugs*)

I'm fine about the fucking but i prefer it without too much emotion so the huggings out I'm afraid.

blank · Post by **blank** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 7:27 pm

Martyn wrote:

A lot of gripes I had have been sorted (ish) with Live 7, the main one being the inability to display more than one automation lane

so you can view more than one lane per track in live 7 ?

Maybe I missed that one

Martyn · Post by **Martyn** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 7:41 pm

blank wrote: so you can view more than one lane per track in live 7 ?

Maybe I missed that one

Yeah, it'd be nice if it'd display all recorded parameters instantly instead of you having to select them and then unfold a new track each time, but who's complaining. I've already found it hugely usable.

Sales Dude McBoob · Post by **Sales Dude McBoob** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 8:03 pm

Leaving Live for Fruit Loops? Cheerio, m'lad, cheerio.

But why stopping to crank such a big fart on your way out the door? Couldn't be that you actually like Live better than Fruit Loops, now could it? Hmmmm?

blank · Post by **blank** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:00 pm

Martyn wrote:
blank wrote: so you can view more than one lane per track in live 7 ?

Maybe I missed that one

Yeah, it'd be nice if it'd display all recorded parameters instantly instead of you having to select them and then unfold a new track each time, but who's complaining. I've already found it hugely usable.

FINALY !!!!!!

YIPEEEEEEE!!!!!!!

is there a notepad somewhere too ?

synnack · Post by **synnack** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:06 pm

Once again I wonder why people only use one application or another. Most apps have their strengths and weaknesses. I use Ableton mostly because of the features it has that no other software can touch.

However there are a few things I do like about FL. I don't see it as some sort of war between what is better, but features that one has that the other lacks.

Ableton has more cool stuff than I could possible type that FL lacks.

On the flip side though, FL has some great stuff that you can't really do in Ableton. Since people have asked for examples I'll list a a few.

1) Peak Controller - this device can basically put an lfo to any other peramter that can be automated. Even the master tempo and pitch of the entire song. There is also a knob when using random lfo shapes to change the seed used to calculate the "random" pattern. In Ableton, either you draw the "lfo" shape as a clip envelope, or hope the particular device you want has LFO routing capabilities built in.

2) Drum pattern layout - Live 7's drum racks blows everything away for sure, but one cool thing about FL is that you can actually see each different channel/tracks midi data on the same screen. You can only do that in ableton if it's all in the same clip as you can only view one cip's midi data at a time. The way FL allows you to create drum patterns by seeing each sound on a different channel is pretty cool.

3) FL Dashboard - people have commented about Logic's new live thing where you can somewhat make your own performance interface. In FL you have been able to built your own custom interfaces with knobs and faders and things and map them to midi controls for years.

4) Beepmap - There is an FL device that lets you feed it an image file and have it create sound based off of it's properties. Pretty neat.

I could go on....

Thankfully I can use both.