krulecello wrote:
If I have challenged you to think, that's good. I'm still waiting for you to be honest. You do have a habit of pointing the finger at governments and corporations (or anyone else) whilst ignoring your own complicity and the physical reality / facts. You can frame this in whatever way you like, 'conspiracy', 'the real world', 'they be all mighty (monster), me be innocent victim (mouse)', 'relevance', etc.
You can continue to spread as much propaganda as you like about the 'physical reality defying' greenwash technologies in the hope that you wont have to give up 'your' lifestyle.
You can throw as much money as you like, sign as many partitions as you like, chain yourself to as many trees as you like, partake in as many forum discussions as you like on war, poverty, human stupidity, climate change, economy, etc ... you can even vote in 'compulsory democratic' Australian elections and believe, obediently, that your vote counts and that one political party or politician is somehow better than the other..... all are vain attempts to save the very people and places that are currently being destroyed by your 'complicity'.
You are complicit in this corrupt system because you accept its ideology.
By driving a car and traveling by plane, you are highly complicit in the pollution of, and destruction of, life on this planet, right now.
"I never didn't admit that" does not equate to "I admit that."
Well, you can keep accusing me of being dishonest if you like, but I
honestly don't know what it is I'm supposedly being dishonest about. Everything I've said here is what i believe to be true, that doesn't mean I'm right, but it does mean I'm being honest.
Okay, for the sake of semantics I'll state more clearly:
I fully admit that I am complicit, if that's what you mean. But you are really mistaken if you think that you are not too. I don't think what you are doing is actually enough to actually change anything at all. If everybody did then it could be, but they won't, so it won't. Don't intperpret that as me saying YOU should do MORE, I'm just saying that if you want to point fingers and talk about complicity then there's no way you can live here in our wealthy country and not be complicit if you are refusing to have anything to do with the system that we have or attempt to change it.
If you really believe that the system is so broken and worthless that it is completely ineffective, and at the same time governments and corporations are acting in ways that are causing massive damage to our planet, then shouldn't we try and change that? You have taken a view that it's too difficult, or too hopeless to even bother trying to deal with that problem. You're not alone there, most people have. It's very tempting to just give up and let the bastards do what the fuck they like completely unchallenged, but what you are suggesting to me seems to be like putting out a spot fire when the entire forest is burning down.
Again, I'm not trying to tell you personally that
you should do anything more at all, but if we live in a system that is so corrupt that it is destroying the planet we are living on, then we really should do something about changing it. If that task is hopeless then your plan is even more so.
What you keep trying to frame as "finger pointing at the government" or being a "victim" is actually the total opposite. It is a real rage at the endemic corruption in the way things are run, and a refusal to just keep quiet about it.
It's easy to feel completely at a loss as to what to do about it most of the time, and it can easily turn into pessemism and hopelessness. But I am trying to pay attention to what governments and corporations are really up to and passing on that message as much as I can in the hope that as many people as possible are aware of it, which is at least a start. The more people hear about the evil shit going on, then at some point there will be a breaking point. The outpouring against Monsanto being a great example. And of course, Occupy.
If you suddenly found a Monsanto field next to yours and a lawyer turned up on your doorstep suing you for stealing their patented seeds after they had blown onto your property then I guess you'd start taking an interest in what corporations are up to.
Or if all the bees started dying here like they are in North America. If they succeed in killing of the bees worldwide then we are really well and truly screwed.
Likewise, I'm not sure about how you'd stop anyone from dredging the barrier reef on your own, or find anyone else to do it with if you can't find common ground even with people who are basically on your side, especially not with people with vastly different views.
