ATTN Abes: Bad Skin Colors

forge · Post by **forge** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 5:11 am

pearsonart.com wrote:I agree.

If I understood the code back in October, I would have simply made new versions of the 1.1 default and Barrett that look the same in version 5. Those 2 themes suit me half the time. In fact, both still worked correctly up till version 5 was released.

Visit my site and you'll understand that I've been using oranges as a primary subject in my work for 6 years. Neutrals are useful in context but not as a dominant theme.

Seriously, hire me as a part time color consultant and designer. I've been painting professionally for 6 years. I also worked as a broadcast video and audio engineer for CBS, PBS and Warner Bros for 14 years so I'm in a unique position to understand how visual aesthetics affect creativity in a technical environment.

James
www.pearsonart.com

well there you go Abe, hire him!

supster · Post by **supster** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 5:40 am

forge wrote:
pearsonart.com wrote:I agree.

If I understood the code back in October, I would have simply made new versions of the 1.1 default and Barrett that look the same in version 5. Those 2 themes suit me half the time. In fact, both still worked correctly up till version 5 was released.

Visit my site and you'll understand that I've been using oranges as a primary subject in my work for 6 years. Neutrals are useful in context but not as a dominant theme.

Seriously, hire me as a part time color consultant and designer. I've been painting professionally for 6 years. I also worked as a broadcast video and audio engineer for CBS, PBS and Warner Bros for 14 years so I'm in a unique position to understand how visual aesthetics affect creativity in a technical environment.

James
www.pearsonart.com
well there you go Abe, hire him!

seriously...sounds like the guy ..
.

icedsushi · Post by **icedsushi** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 3:11 pm

sounds good...

On the idea of a "skin editor"...I think that phrase sounds complicated so I'm not sure what you guys have in mind. There wouldn't need to be a special program or anything.

The way I would like to see it, it would just be built into one of tabs in Live's prefs. However many colored areas of the GUI there are would show up as names for each area and simple colored boxes in prefs for each area. What is it, maybe 7 or 8 color choices...I haven't counted.

You would just click on the colored boxes and the OS's color wheel would pop up and you pick whatever hue/saturation/color you like (just like choosing color for other things in MaxOSX for example) and hit OK.

I'm no programmer but this doesn't seem it would be so hard to implement, using the OS resources that are already there.

Angstrom · Post by **Angstrom** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 3:17 pm

icedsushi wrote: However many colored areas of the GUI there are would show up as names for each area and simple colored boxes in prefs for each area. What is it, maybe 7 or 8 color choices...I haven't counted..

erm, well ... more like 40 ish , you'd be surprised.

to re-iterate - there wont be a skin editor application available to the public unless Ableton make one, as it is illegal for a 3rd party to make one, as Alex stated earlier in the thread.

icedsushi · Post by **icedsushi** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 3:22 pm

really? OK well how about just like I said...Abes just having a skin tab in prefs and 40 little boxes there. The color wheel just pops up when you click on a box if you want to change one.

I was suggesting that Ableton do it...not a 3rd party. And how simple the implementation could be integrated with the OS...that it doesn't have to be this huge overwhelming application project.

Maybe I am stating the obvious though.

MrYellow · Post by **MrYellow** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:27 am

Well make one!

-Ben

sweetjesus · Post by **sweetjesus** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:34 am

pearsonart.com wrote:I agree.

If I understood the code back in October, I would have simply made new versions of the 1.1 default and Barrett that look the same in version 5. Those 2 themes suit me half the time. In fact, both still worked correctly up till version 5 was released.

Visit my site and you'll understand that I've been using oranges as a primary subject in my work for 6 years. Neutrals are useful in context but not as a dominant theme.

Seriously, hire me as a part time color consultant and designer. I've been painting professionally for 6 years. I also worked as a broadcast video and audio engineer for CBS, PBS and Warner Bros for 14 years so I'm in a unique position to understand how visual aesthetics affect creativity in a technical environment.

James
www.pearsonart.com

with respects to your credentials, i have my own and i beg to differ to your views on color schemes.

as a compositor and designer who has had to spend many years in front of software some of which i have had to stare at for 20+ hours a day, i can comfortably say that the color schemes that Discreet supply in their packages (Combustion, Flint, Flame, Inferno) have been designed to provide minimal eye strain and allow focus on whatever it is you look at on the screen rather clearly.

Certain colors also give cues in software, so unless you are a specific user inerface designer, then the logic behind every miniscule color choice and how it bears on user interaction and human behaviour and how it helps someone understand the flow and logic of the software in question, then you will be simply making something that feels nice but is not intuitive.

pearsonart.com · Post by **pearsonart.com** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:20 pm

No doubt and I'm sure you understand that my "application" isn't going to be taken seriously. It's a challenge.

Here's another perspective.

I happen to think that most software is ugly and I'm not alone. It's not elegant and often dreary. With few exceptions, most people would never hang something on the wall that looked like that. Why shouldn't software look as good as fine art?

The "eyestrain" arguement needs to be rethought. While it's a necessary requirement for some "power" users, it's not a solution for everyone. Case in point: what motivates people to spend time with software to begin with? I'd suggest it may be the same kinds of visual stimuli that pull people into a good painting.

The problem with most technical and industrial design is that it is self involved. Here I am, a user of software among many, saying that greys and neutrals are depressing and yet, most software designers will continue to tell me that I really don't want color, it will hurt my eyes. Design should be responsive as well as visionary.

Best wishes,
James
www.pearsonart.com

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:47 pm

I hope there will be a place for both of your arguments once we have a stable hack of an .ask creator. Those who want full-blown pleaser aesthetics can have that, and those who want a minimal, calming setup can have that - and switch it up every once in a while.

The main thing I'm hearing from people is that they actually like changing the skin every now and then, as it gives the users a new approach to the software - I dig that. So an orange one for the party, and a grey one back at the studio?

Angstrom · Post by **Angstrom** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:51 pm

Machinate wrote:I hope there will be a place for both of your arguments once we have a stable hack of an .ask creator.

sorry, there wont be a hacked ASK creator released from either sqook or me due to infringements on the EULA

robin · Post by **robin** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:54 pm

Booo!

Ok Abes time to give us all a xmas pressie and give us an official ASK editor. Please.

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:56 pm

Nah, they shouldn't be wasting their time on it - instead, sqook, Angstrom and SweetJesus should huddle, and we'll set up a paypal donation for them

sweetjesus · Post by **sweetjesus** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 2:00 pm

Machinate wrote:Nah, they shouldn't be wasting their time on it - instead, sqook, Angstrom and SweetJesus should huddle, and we'll set up a paypal donation for them

yeh to get us out of prison once ableton lock us up.

pearsonart.com · Post by **pearsonart.com** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 2:06 pm

The way I understand it, anyone is still welcome to mod/make skins and offer them to the public for free.

The official ableton response even encouraged this saying that these designs might influence future official releases.

We have been told not to share how it was done or make an editor to do so.

That's an important distinction.

MrYellow · Post by **MrYellow** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 2:43 pm

Any response other than "Don't stress guys the abes will have a util or
feature for you in a short while" is a waste of breath for me.

To lock users from improving the software while refusing to improve the
software just plain sucks.

I CAN'T SEE MY CLIP PLAY POSITION!!!!!!

This is happening to me today. Having a half assed response that
says "don't do what everyone wants"..... Is shit..... I wanted this feature
like 6 months ago.

Sorry if that sounds harsh, but I really don't care about possible future
incompatibilities, possible future problems, possible changes to the skin
engine or anything else..... I just wanna see my clip play position without
blinding myself...... And you won't let me....

-Ben