Ableton Forum

Posted: **Sun Jul 21, 2013 3:46 pm**

timothyallan wrote:Yeah, like I said, it's doing 'something'! Can't find anything concrete except for general consumer Apple talk:

"The Process Buffer Range: setting determines how large a buffer Logic sets aside for its mixing engine. As with the I/O Buffer Size, smaller settings decrease latency, but increase CPU load. The default setting of Medium is usually fine, but if you experience frequent System Overloads, then try setting it to Large."

So there's a mixing buffer, and i/o buffer.

Well, if Apple won't give specifics... I'll find them out I have a neato utility which let's me see what my UAD plugins are running at as far as a buffer latency. If I use a 128 buffer in Logic, I can still see that the UAD plugs are running at 1088 samples. Changing the i/o buffer in logic has no effect on the plugins... however, changing the process buffer range does indeed change it. Setting it to large increases the buffer to a whopping 2112 samples.

So yes, Logic maintains a pseudo-hidden mixing buffer, but no, it doesn't change it on playback, it's always there.

Now we've all learned something today!

Yeah, I think this also explains why it takes a split second the first time when you have a softsynth part running and you play it with your keyboard after playing back a midi region on that track. I think this also explains why when you move an audio region away from the play head that it takes some time to actually take affect.

I think this is a really clever way of doing things, but like it's been said since Live's application is meant for performance too they didn't take that approach. Would be cool if you could enable something like this in preferences for the many people that use Live for production only rather than live performance.

Thanks for doing this test, now we know! Very helpful!

Ken

Posted: **Sun Jul 21, 2013 4:18 pm**

timothyallan wrote:I edited my post above with the 1024 results... The Synth is the beta of Spire.

Edit: I'm off to check out the buffer switching rumor, Logic is def. doing something at lower buffer settings. However, if I change the buffer setting manually, Logic has to restart all of core audio, so I'm almost positive Logic wouldn't be switching buffer settings on playback... but it's doing something

Does Logic maintain that percentage regardless of soft synth used? Would you do the test with something like Zebra or Massive? Spire is very inefficient and is not yet optimized as a beta so perhaps that is skewing the results?

It is a compelling argument for Logic if the 128 buffer can consistently give more than 3x instances. I'm curious whether that is consistent across computers too, or if fewer cores (I have a quad core) means less difference?

Posted: **Sun Jul 21, 2013 4:54 pm**

timothyallan wrote:Since I regularly get to the end of a project in Live and get sputtering audio because of CPU usage, this is the biggest reason I use Logic:

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid= ... 426&type=1#

I've done a CPU stress test between Logic X and Live 9.05 and posted the results.

We have been talking for ages. It's a traditional topic in Live's history.
https://www.google.co.jp/search?&q=site ... +multicore

Posted: **Sun Jul 21, 2013 5:21 pm**

The retro synth by itself is kind of worth at least $100. This is sort of a no-brainer.

Posted: **Sun Jul 21, 2013 7:48 pm**

timothyallan wrote: So there's a mixing buffer, and i/o buffer.

From what I remember of a conversation online with Urs Heckman (apologies to Urs if I'm misquoting here!),
Live polls all plug ins and literally anything you can tweak on it's interface constantly, for 'live' performance glitch free experiences.
This costs CPU, a lot of CPU. Logic polls only record enabled tracks, all other tracks are probably given this 'mixing' buffer, which is much higher. Digital Performer does plug in Pre-rendering (sort of like 'auto-freeze') to accomplish much the same thing.

Come to think of it this might have been why Logic had the audio editing bug for a while? supposedly fixed in Logic X.

Posted: **Sun Jul 21, 2013 7:49 pm**

djadonis206 wrote:The retro synth by itself is kind of worth at least $100. This is sort of a no-brainer.

I'm tempted for sure, but Mainstage 3 includes this synth, and I'm pretty happy with DP, although Logic X looks fantastic!
Didn't like the direction the interface was going in with Logic 8 and 9.

Posted: **Mon Jul 22, 2013 4:29 pm**

Well I bit the bullet and upgraded.

Have to say once I got over the initial gripes (mainly no update to sampler!) it's actually a pretty cool update.

Absolutely loving the ipad app

The scale and chord keyboards are great for inputing and having the key commands on the ipad are also brilliant.

Given the price, it's a bloody steal compared to Live!!

Posted: **Mon Jul 22, 2013 4:58 pm**

i love logic.

Posted: **Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:06 pm**

Err.... no, not at all, there's a LOT more in this update.

Posted: **Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:23 pm**

Quickly:
1. Melodyne style flex pitch.
2. multiple new instruments and FX.
3. iPad App.
4. new grouping behaviors.
5. new ease of rearranging plugins in tracks.
6. new MIDI FX.
7. new Score Editor features.
8. New sound libraries.
Plus probably dozens of smaller improvements.

It's a good upgrade. My only reason for not bothering yet is my comfort level with Digital Performer, and the fact that 1,3, 5, 6, 7 were already apart of DP for years.

Posted: **Mon Jul 22, 2013 6:40 pm**

logic is affordable.

Posted: **Mon Jul 22, 2013 6:49 pm**

OJ KARDASHIAN wrote:ableton live 9 will run on xp,vista,windows 7,windows 8, plus OSX.
nice range.

logic pro X ? only mountain lion? lame .

That ugly celebrity screen name gives you away as another useless mult..

Christ? could your reasons for not liking a piece of software be any dumber?
Fruity Loops, Sonar, Samplitude, Sequoia, Synth Edit etc. etc. all run exclusively on Windows.
Give the pre-school whinging a break.

Posted: **Mon Jul 22, 2013 6:52 pm**

logic is god.

Posted: **Mon Jul 22, 2013 6:54 pm**

Posted: **Mon Jul 22, 2013 6:55 pm**

logic is fun.

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