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Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 9:57 am
by re:dream
I think time will tell.
I see a lot of very odd and emotional responses on this thread. It's like BW are some rival posse that are gonna come take our hoes or something
DAWs are complicated and learning them takes time. The test of a DAW is not in its features, but in how it integrates those features in a package that is easy to use. This is revealed over time. You can't judge that on the basis of a one hour session.
If BW does a good job of creating an integrated and awesome to use, there is a chance that it will develop a core body of good users exploring it, testing and expanding its capabilities. This body will do what we ave been doing - developing controller mappings, making new presets, developing a core set of practices that define how the software is used, and which influences its future development. This
also happens over time. And it may even fail to happen with really good software - if the costs of adaptation etc are too high
Personally, I hope they make it.
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 9:59 am
by 5argon
I see high page count so I came to read about possible Bitwig's flaw but 2 pages is already about BASS GUITARS AND THE DAMN HYDROGEN
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 10:06 am
by 5argon
WOW the Bitwig's color palette for track color is beautiful and is impossible to create eye cancer out of it. (Unlike Ableton's lol)
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:39 pm
by fx23
Let's see the good things
All they are showing in V1 is nearly what was live at V5-6 with some nice improvments. It's supposely a fresher and cleaner programming with more modularity for future tweaks, less complicated for backward compatibilities.
It's not replacing live yet, but in short time they should probably match/over, and for now they are half price, all of this can only be good for consummer.
ableton will atlast have some serious challenger.
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:49 pm
by wildcon
I think time will tell.
I see a lot of very odd and emotional responses on this thread. It's like BW are some rival posse that are gonna come take our hoes or something
DAWs are complicated and learning them takes time. The test of a DAW is not in its features, but in how it integrates those features in a package that is easy to use. This is revealed over time. You can't judge that on the basis of a one hour session.
If BW does a good job of creating an integrated and awesome to use, there is a chance that it will develop a core body of good users exploring it, testing and expanding its capabilities. This body will do what we ave been doing - developing controller mappings, making new presets, developing a core set of practices that define how the software is used, and which influences its future development. This also happens over time. And it may even fail to happen with really good software - if the costs of adaptation etc are too high
Personally, I hope they make it.
I completely agree.
I've been watching the fervent (mainly negative) responses with more than a little interest. Would have made a brilliant case study for when I was studying Psychology!
I've not tried the demo, and will wait to see what comes. From the feedback there's obviously some shortcomings.
I was in with Live from version 3 and counted myself a a complete fanboy. However, as time has gone on, I have become more disenchanted with the product and the support (and the cost!!) What I was hoping for from BW was Live with all the stuff that didn't work in Live sorted! Way too much to ask for I guess. I was also excited about the interface and colourschemes. From a Psychological point of view I find working in Live pretty uninspiring and the flat 'minimalist' colours leave me cold. I prefer to mixdown in Logic partly as I love to work in something that feels more lifelike or Hardwarelike! But hey I'm an old timer and love real life mixing desks and tapes etc
So BW is not Live 10+ as I had unrealistically hoped, but I will definitely keeping an open mind, and good luck to them
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:24 pm
by H20nly
5argon wrote:WOW the Bitwig's color palette for track color is beautiful and is impossible to create eye cancer out of it. (Unlike Ableton's lol)
you should uninstall Ableton Live and never look back.
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:27 pm
by kb420
H20nly wrote:you should uninstall Ableton Live and never look back.
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:48 pm
by Saxer
Anybody did more than a few one-bar-loops in Bitwig? When looking at the videos there's nearly no musical content.
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 4:47 pm
by nemoy
Saxer wrote:...When looking at the videos there's nearly no musical content.
...like in all them push videos...
That's how things are done these days...
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:10 pm
by su
Saxer wrote:Anybody did more than a few one-bar-loops in Bitwig?
Can't be done. It's a limitation of V1. Go ahead. Look at the timeline in arrange view. One bar only. Maybe in V2.
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:14 pm
by eyeknow
This is my branz after reading these bitwig threads.
Of course it has potential. But it's a 400usd pricetag. That's a lot of money for "potential"
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:46 pm
by c33
Based on everything I’ve been reading the past few days it sounds like it has potential. I doubt it’s something that I’m ever going to pick up (I’m about to start pairing Ableton and Auria and I don’t need another DAW), but if it makes someone else’s music-making-life run a bit smoother, I think that’s great.
Obviously it’s not the savior some people were expecting it to be out of the gate.. but I also have to wonder if some of the initial negative reactions reflect our ever-dwindling attention spans. Sure, sometimes you can absolutely play around with a piece of software for an hour (or far less) and know that it’s not going to work for you. But massive programs like these also require time and patience to learn. I know it took me many many hours of working with Ableton before I had even the slightest clue of what it was really capable of
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:38 pm
by deva
The Finn wrote:It is interesting to note all the performance issues.
For me, CPU usage etc is not the key issue. Perhaps because my music will use 16, 20 tracks max
The big claim for BW is the workflow improvements. That's a more difficult claim to evaluate, partly because it takes a while to get used to new kit, and partly because workflow judgements are more SUBJECTIVE
At the moment, with BW, I can see lots of nice things e.g. about MIDI editing. But on BW I lose all the investments I have made with Live - customized MIDI controllers, STC, Tom's Push mapping - hell, even Funken's Mac Shortcuts for the Fourth Workers' International
... And the switching between the different views all feels very un-intuitive still. So I am not an unbiased judge.
I guess those issues will only be revealed with time.
Yes, it will take time... there are a lot of little core workflow issues.
for example, with knobs you cannot see the value it is set to unless you click AND move it... then you have moved it from what it was... actually, you can also command click to bring up a numeric field but that is also clumsy.
as another example, adjust the velocity of a midi note and you do not hear the change as you do it.
lots of little stuff needs polish...
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:40 pm
by ezelkow1
eyeknow wrote:
This is my branz after reading these bitwig threads.
Of course it has potential. But it's a 400usd pricetag. That's a lot of money for "potential"
And thats what Im left with as well. As with anything dealing with software people eventually start bitching at the dev's about not supporting/doing something (look at the sylenth osx64bit issue) and time and again are told 'purchase the software for what it does now, not what is promised or expected in the future'. So never buy anything based on potential unless you can predict the future accurately.
Especially in this case with a brand new unproven company/group/team, who knows what they will actually follow through with and what they wont, so until there is an idea of a timeline for how they add features and fix bugs (and have actually fixed and added the major issues) I wouldnt even think about purchasing
Re: The Bitwig evaluation thread
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:47 pm
by deva
I don't know if many people use Live's midi step entry because I hardly ever hear anyone mention it, but I find it invaluable. It is fast and can input notes including chords and with velocity data from ones midi keyboard much faster than the mouse.
The lack of this feature in Bitwig is big for me.