Ableton Forum

Man, I don't know about you guys, but I'm tired of spending hours in my bedroom, at the computer, trying to perfect my track, only to have it sound like SHIT in the club... I don't know what the deal is... my one guess could be that I'm not using a limiter/compressor (whatever the tool is that brings up the quieter instruments to match the loud ones). Really, ANY help would be much appreciated, I know some of you guys are in the same boat -- just want your music to sound good at the end of the day

If you guys want, you can check it out, I named it "Ether": http://www.bigcontact.com/mikebeeds

Mike

Do you have decent monitors? That might help you hear what's wrong with your tracks prior to playing them out. Not having the tracks mastered (i.e. they're still quiet volume) is an issue too, yeah. Also make sure nothing is clipping, particularly on the master channel.

so do you feel like it is too quiet in the club? is it lacking bass or a punch? might be able to say something if I knew more about what the problem is, but listening to the track is seems to me like your drums could use some fattening...

if your runing monitors especially ona desktop
buy sum isolating acoustic speaker foam
like the auralex mo pads
will give you a true a bass sound and tighter acustics
think they areabout 35quid
best 35 quid i have ever spent m8
b4 the bass sounded too loud and muddy due too the vibration onthe speeker and desktop
try it out m8

DJ Mike Beeds wrote:Man, I don't know about you guys, but I'm tired of spending hours in my bedroom, at the computer, trying to perfect my track, only to have it sound like SHIT in the club... I don't know what the deal is... my one guess could be that I'm not using a limiter/compressor (whatever the tool is that brings up the quieter instruments to match the loud ones). Really, ANY help would be much appreciated, I know some of you guys are in the same boat -- just want your music to sound good at the end of the day

If you guys want, you can check it out, I named it "Ether": http://www.bigcontact.com/mikebeeds

Mike

Yo Mike,

Checked yer mix...........

All I can say is that you know what you want (builds, drops etc.) but your basic "sounds" are shite!

Your technique is good but you need to concentrate on choice of synth sounds, drum sounds etc.


Don't mean to put you on a downer but keep doing what you're doing with better source material.

Z.

Maybe you just need to work on your mix.
Check the levels, pan and balance between the elements
Make sure there is no clashing frequencies.
The start beefing the track
adding compression to you drums bass etc but not to much or you will take out some of the dynamics.
Also some people make a mix for album and a club mix. Adding more sub bass to the club mix.

The biggest problem I heard is that you don't have enough low end in your kick and bass. Try importing a track you like into your sessions as you mix...solo it against your mix and compare the bass response. Should def help you.

Figgy has a really good point.

Use the spectrum to see what frequencies the track you like has and copy it.

Thank you guys a lot! Yeah, there is little to no low-end in the track... how might I get more in the track? Could I do that with EQing? I'm wondering if I should add another bass instrument in the track just for that purpose...

I did notice, when getting an image of the track, that I have some low-end spikes, which could cause some clipping, not sure what that might be caused from...

As far as samples go, I used Native Instruments and a couple of instruments in Ableton (I think in Operator...). What would you guys recommend for drums and percussion? I think I remember reading on here somewhere that "serious drummer" is a decent program, but I haven't used it before... I also suppose that analog synths are definitely much better as well...

About acoustics, I do in fact have the Auralex isolation pads, but I'm still thinking it's not enough... I will look into getting a bass trap for the corner and also some foam for the wall just behind my speakers. Ah, but I don't know what to say about the Bx5a's... they seem really muffled for some reason

I really appreciate everyone's feedback here...

while you could throw money at the problem to fix it
i reckon your better off learning to make tracks better with what you have
to add more lower end to your kick there are bunch of tricks, look at filter delay sub trick - pitch black posted it here
also download some of the operator presets from ableton - the tr808 bass drum has plenty of bass on it
layer up a bunch of these sounds - use racks of effects to thicken your sounds, try sending a dry mono, a compressed and a chorus all on same track to thicken it up and increase width
listen and analyse tracks to check out what elements are missing in your sound, and keep at it

what ever your bass line in the song is grab that midi clip and copy it into a new track, in that track put operator and use a sin wave single osc and put a chord -12 tool before it, then after it take a filter and without giving it an increase in volume anywhere cut anything above lets say 200ish Hz (no magic frequency) but fiddle around with it and the track volume until your bass line feels fat

the only problem now is that your new sub bass track muddles up your kick, isolate your kick to a separate track and then stick a compressor onto your sub bass track and side chain it to your kick drum, mess with that until your sub bass dips and lets the kick shine

also you can make your drums more punchy without losing dynamic by using parallel compression, google ableton parallel compression

Thanks Zalo! I understand the part about parallel compression (wonder what you guys think about this guy's advice: http://ezinearticles.com/?id=1676565), but I have to be honest mate, I'm completely lost on the part of creating a second track for the bass line...

Excuse my ignorance, but Operator seems pretty intense... I got lost at this part:

use a sin wave single osc and put a chord -12 tool before it, then after it take a filter and without giving it an increase in volume anywhere cut anything above lets say 200ish Hz (no magic frequency)

Thanks Spiral! Is the filter delay sub trick a recent thread in the forum? I'd love to take a look at it, if possible!

just heard it aswell..
i think it's not THAT bad!
as someone mentioned already, there's not enough low end but the overall soundspectrum is clear.
i think another little problem is the arrangement - too confusing...could have a more straight line in all.
also someone said your soundselection is sh**...i don't agree fully. just a little something should be replaced but its not a drama.
try selecting sounds that don't fight each other...worst case scenario IF a bassline and kickdrum fight each other use some soft sidechain compression
via ableton compressor.

your track doesnt need compression/limiting at all. it's more a better EQing and defining elements more.
no idea what speakers you have but it's VERY important that these present what's really happening!


good luck

It's pretty bad... lol. So, I took your advice, compared the wave spectrum between my track and... "Miami To Atlanta" by Prydz, and as I suspected, Prydz's track was maxed out -- like, a completely full wave bar from start to finish (at least when there weren't any drops or breakdowns). Miro says that my track doesn't need a limiter/compressor, but how else do you achieve such a complete spectrum?

ok the following:

keep in mind that tracks, before being (over-)maximized have a certain ammount of thickness and bass.
when you start limiting so much (in his case typical for today's loudness wars) you will 100% lose
bass anyway and the high end will mostly start and get harsh!
also: professional mastering engineers (working in real mastering studios with high end hardware etc)
get most of the loudness by clever and experienced EQing and sometimes going through several devices like
expensive hardware compressors for coloration (not for super compression with -6dB GR)
but it's very much EQing the stuff.

the closer you can get your mix to a really dope mix the less he will do.
if you have a record deal or whatever you don't have to worry about your tracks IF they get properly mastered.
if you're doing it for yourself then remember that the after EQing and esp. limiting will influence the sound!

dynamics and transients will be less among with bass if not done properly.
in the track i heard of you it wasn't something that couldn't be corrected.

check your low end more and try to seperate the bassline and the kick in any way (EQ, sidechain etc)
also try to replace teh bass synth with another plugin that "comes through better" (that's OFTEN the point)
since many have a nice "sound" but not the strength for "pushing" through in the whole mix!!

some soft synth have way more pressure than others! try it