Ableton Forum

Hi everyone. i was wandering if anybody knows how to create the traktor delay t3 in ableton. I know it is possible since all the effects in ableton are created from source and the traktor effects are similar. Can anybody help or give me a link were i can do this cause i can't find anything on the internet and am stuck. Much appreciated )

What's special about it? Not to say not to bother!

Just wondering what is different about that delay than others (I have never used Traktor).

you could just buy it. all of traktors dj effects are available as vst's to use within live....

http://www.native-instruments.com/#/en/ ... ?page=1497

Sounds like Live's ping pong delay to me.

Traktor's 12 isn't all of Traktor's effects. It's just twelve of them. There is a delay but as far as I've looked at it so far, it just seems like a basic one and I'm not sure what the T3 delay does extra.

Sorry bringing this up again, but seriously, T3 is awesome and I used Traktor and T3 delay for my kick drums in my last album alongside ableton for the rest of the drums. Massive pain running two programs simultaneously, and my new drumkit on ableton is so much more cpu-demanding that I'd have to carry two computers, so an extra soundcard, syncing leads etc, so not ideal!
Trying to avoid it for the new album but I cannot get such a smooth, click-free, unmuddy pounding kick with reliably interesting but clearly rhythmic rhythm that I have the same versatility to control over as I had from Traktor.

Anyone know how to recreate this delay in ableton?
I think the key difference (whether this is how it actually works or not) is it slides through time more analogously, ableton will make digitally-timed delay repeats stick to a quantized beat of 16th or 8th notes. Yes there are the -33% to +33% sliders, but for my use I need to slide seamlessly, without a chance of waves to get cut or other clicking, kicks around the beat from a single control, not two (one for the quantized beat and one for the in/out of sync). My band do a lot of improvising live, so I can't achieve this trial-and-error in a studio.

The_Subject wrote: Anyone know how to recreate this delay in ableton?
I think the key difference (whether this is how it actually works or not) is it slides through time more analogously, ableton will make digitally-timed delay repeats stick to a quantized beat of 16th or 8th notes. Yes there are the -33% to +33% sliders, but for my use I need to slide seamlessly, without a chance of waves to get cut or other clicking, kicks around the beat from a single control, not two (one for the quantized beat and one for the in/out of sync). My band do a lot of improvising live, so I can't achieve this trial-and-error in a studio.

Right click on the SimpleDelays header and set it to re-pitch (an often overlooked awesome feature of it), this should allow you to move the swing without clicks. It does produce re-pitching artifacts though. But I think they sound interesting.

If you try to assemble kick rythms live, something I'm doing too, you should also try out this cool method I came up with recently:

On the DrumRack with your kick, replace the Sampler/Simpler with another DrumRack (which then contains your Sampler/Simpler.
Make chains for all 6 DrumRack sends of this internal Drumrack. Put into each return chain a SimpleDelay Linked 100% Wet. Vary the settings of the Delays in each chain so that they cover the whole range of one bar.
Assign the Send volumes of your kick to a button controller (toggle).
Route these sends to other tracks, but don't route the kick chain itself. This way your rythm becomes independent from the original note placement.

Now you can switch different rythms on and off.
If you have more buttons available, assign them to controls of the Delays like Feedback (to like 40%), Link (put a Utility device set to 0% width after the Delay so that you double the kick at different timings but don't make it stereo), or indeed Swing.
You can also put other effects in there that then only affect that one kick placement and not the others.

If you want to get really smooth, you would have a fader device control the volume of these six return chains.

Basically a step sequencer on steroids

I use this with a very simple one bar kick loop (just one note on the 1.1.1), and produce all the rythms on the fly.

If you do techno or the like, putting BeatRepeats with a grid size of 1/2 or 1/4th into the sends (or original chain) gives a few short cuts to fast rythms.

Just an idea

You do live kick rhythms? What kinda stuff do you do?

The delay in separate chains I have used, sometimes in combination with momentary triggered effects, which can be quite nice but has the annoying bar to work out whats going on, and CPU usage starts dying when I make a chain for every possible groove I might play.

The problem usually comes in when I change sync-rate of the kick, and I can go all through speeds for the tracks (I usually use an arpeggiator to start with for this) and cannot get a macro to make the delays or beat repeats respond perfectly to each syn-rate.

Just trying to download the new NI delay Replika that's free on their website this month. Haven't been sent their email despite a couple of attempts, but assuming I can get it, I'll update here what its like....

have a good christmas etc!

I must say I don't understand the gain of doing kicks this way, not in Traktor nor with delays. Is it to make each hit different in some fashion or what's all this about?

I just make patterns, short or long, and variations of them and place beats as I want them. I use delays on individual drum voices, but not for the basic patterns. Any audio examples you guys can share?

The_Subject wrote:You do live kick rhythms? What kinda stuff do you do?

This is for my live Techno improv project, so that definitely plays into if doing this is feasible or not.

The delay in separate chains I have used, sometimes in combination with momentary triggered effects, which can be quite nice but has the annoying bar to work out whats going on, and CPU usage starts dying when I make a chain for every possible groove I might play.

My set up consists of the 6 DrumRack sends and Lives SimpleDelay and a BeatRepeat before and a Utility behind that in each of them.
If this brings your CPU to its knees, you should move on from the C64 you are using

But it's a matter of how you set it up.
You don't make a chain for every groove.

The simplest set up is only with the delays. 6 Sends=6SimpleDelays. 1, 3, 5, 7, 11, 16/16th respectively 100% wet and Linked.
This only works well if you have a controller like the Launchpad with tons of regularly arranged buttons.
Assign the Send volumes of all 6 DrumRack sends to 6 buttons in a row.

Use a midi clip to trigger this that is only 1 bar long and only has one note for the kick on the 1.1.1

For extra usefulness you route only the return chains to tracks that you use, while the original goes nowhere.
This way only when a DrumRack send is activated you hear that kick on that specific timing.

I would then do the same with a second kick, and assign its send volumes to the button row below.

The remaining buttons in the columns below each of the Send volume toggles, I now assign to the following.
An on/off for a BeatRepeat with a grid size of either 1/4 or 1/2; a Swing value toggle (where the second value is 1/32nd early), the Link toggle (with the same delay timing but a swing value that makes it 1/32nd late <- for this to be useful you need the Utility after the Delay set to 0% stereo); Feedback toggle 0% and 45%

Other toggles could be an Autofilter or a reverb or whatever really.

Now toggling these two kicks at all these different values and at the different original timings is what assembles the groove.

It gets even better if you have one of these cheap fader units like the korg one and assign each sends volume to a fader.
This way you can really morph smoothly between the different rhythms.

I find it very fluid and varied, but I admit Techno is probably not the most challenging in this regard.

The problem usually comes in when I change sync-rate of the kick, and I can go all through speeds for the tracks (I usually use an arpeggiator to start with for this) and cannot get a macro to make the delays or beat repeats respond perfectly to each sun-rate.

I didn't quite get that.

Stromkraft wrote:I must say I don't understand the gain of doing kicks this way, not in Traktor nor with delays. Is it to make each hit different in some fashion or what's all this about?

I just make patterns, short or long, and variations of them and place beats as I want them. I use delays on individual drum voices, but not for the basic patterns.

This is not for writing tracks in the studio, this is mostly for live improv.

For me just switching between different preassembled rhythm clips was not live enough yet, but finger drumming was a.) too difficult and b.) if you finger drum your kick rhythm in Techno at about 120BPM then there is not much else you do and that again was not enough for me.

The advantage of having each timing basically being a unique audio channel, is that you can easily affect them differently. Either the rhythm or the sound.
Imagine you use the feedback on only one of these delays in one of the sends, while all the other timings are just the simple kick, now with the switch of two buttons, you turn the other feedback on and the first one off. Since the delays are of different timings, the feedback also produces a different feel.

Now do the same with an auto filter: Only one kick placement does a filter sweep over 8 bars, the others maintain a steady rhythm.

So on and so forth.

It's basically a rhythm instrument. You can learn to play it more with intuition than punching in notes in a step sequencer or using note repeat would be. Which are two other things I had tried before, but with which I was not happy in how the playing felt or the results sounded.

The reason why you wouldn't really want to write your tracks like this in the studio is, that even though you are still in Midi, the resulting recording is just a very boring midi note repeated over and over and over and extremely complicated and varied automation.
You could probably still correct bad fuck ups, but minute changes to make it sit perfectly would drive you mental in a heart beat.

On the other hand, if fiddling too much with the Midi in arrangement is one of the problems you have holding you back, this method might be a relief

Any audio examples you guys can share?

here is a practice session from last week, but be gentle I'm still learning
But it's pure improv nothing was prepared exept for the drum kit selection................................ and the year I spend arriving at this design
And nothing was corrected afterwards.
filepi.com/i/nRbIZbx