Ableton Forum

Good Day fellow Abletoners,

Allow me to explain first that I am still learning but have spent the last 10 or so months seriously studying and trying. I currently devour Future Publishing's Computer Music Magazine and read whatever I can, including Tarekith's guide which I found here.

My problem is that I am at the end of my rope regarding mastering and the horrors of different speaker systems etc. Please understand I have very little money being the only provider in my family and thus have to do the best I can with Ableton Live only.

Firstly, here's the problem track: http://soundcloud.com/meme-music/shamel ... mellow-mix

And now here's my problem. I did what many guides suggested. I listened to my track on different speakers, drove around in the car, even sat in the garage in the car to test it and I was really happy with the sound of it from multiple environments.

Then recently I listened to it on my iPhone using the stock standard ear buds and it was like there was no bass at all. One could say it sounded "bright" but that would be kind because it sounds weak. It also sounds wide, strangely wide, like the sound is occurring in front of you and to the side but it doesn't sound like this in the car or anywhere else.

If anyone can help, I would really appreciate it!

Furthermore, If there's an honest and interested party out there that is happy to help (and unfortunately I can't afford anyone's services) and if NEED be I am happy to create a version of the project where I have turned off all the effects, rendered out each track as a wave and bring them into a new project with identical effects on each track, identical return tracks and identical mastering chain.

P.s. This was a track that I entered into a remix competition and although it didn't win I like the track and want to learn as much as I can from it.

Thank you kindly.

there was a lack of bass on standard ipod headphones??! fuckin hell! usually their bass response is second to none!

what what? they sounded different on headphones than they did on your car speakers?!! iv never heard of that happening EVER!

Low end is a little pulled back overall, especially the kick compared to the bassline. You seem to have a lot of low mids (250-400Hz) too, which is sort of muddying the mix up. Even though it's not crazy loud, it still sounds over-compressed and one-dimensional to me, there's no depth to it.

Not sure what you did to master it, so it's hard to offer any suggestions. I have an hour free this afternoon, so if you can get me a 24bit mixdown fairly quickly (with no processing on the master channel!), I'll throw you a bone and do it for free. Provided you post the before and after results for others to hear. Your call.

it`s really hard to mix and master and have it sound good on any system.
and within 10 months, you won`t get there.
it will take you 10 years to become a good mastering engineer,
spend hours every day in a studio, get to know your speakers and the tools,
and you need to have a good pair of ears, as well.
why do you think, these mastering studios are paid that much, to do a decent job?

all i can tell you is nothing new to you, you went there already, and know what to look at.
but don`t expect to be perfect from reading.
use your ears, if you listen on a system where your track doesn`t sound as you expect,
go back and try to adjust it.
listen again, and see if you were able to improove.
but, again: don`t expect too much.

my guess would be the issue's more in the mixing than mastering.

the ipod buds do suck but i'm sure you're aware of this and you want your bass/kick to match sonically to other tracks.
if you're really diligent then i'd try remixing again with the monitors and the ipod headphones; find a compromise. Of course this is if you care that much. you won't be able to make your track sound great on every single sound system.

Tarekith wrote:Low end is a little pulled back overall, especially the kick compared to the bassline. You seem to have a lot of low mids (250-400Hz) too, which is sort of muddying the mix up. Even though it's not crazy loud, it still sounds over-compressed and one-dimensional to me, there's no depth to it.

Not sure what you did to master it, so it's hard to offer any suggestions. I have an hour free this afternoon, so if you can get me a 24bit mixdown fairly quickly (with no processing on the master channel!), I'll throw you a bone and do it for free. Provided you post the before and after results for others to hear. Your call.

I have read all your guides, thank you so much responding to my thread. I'm actually at work at the moment so I fear I may miss your deadline. I'd be MORE than happy to post a before and after, especially as your guides are quite prominent (and prolific, I've found them on a few sites ) I'm just not sure I can make it by this afternoon.

I certainly appreciate the offer though and if you're still able to help (I understand that free time is a difficulty) I'd greatly value any insights you can offer.

ipod buds sound like a dick in your ear. what did you expect?

jtdj wrote:there was a lack of bass on standard ipod headphones??! fuckin hell! usually their bass response is second to none!

what what? they sounded different on headphones than they did on your car speakers?!! iv never heard of that happening EVER!

The problem is I can take a professionally mastered track and it sounds remarkably similar whether it's in the car or on my monitors, thus the entire purpose of this thread. And yes, I agree that the ipod headphones have good bass response, thus my surprise when it sounded weak and thin.

I do understand that my problem is a common one, and that my lack of finances is an impediment but it never hurts to ask, right?

kanuck wrote:my guess would be the issue's more in the mixing than mastering.

the ipod buds do suck but i'm sure you're aware of this and you want your bass/kick to match sonically to other tracks.
if you're really diligent then i'd try remixing again with the monitors and the ipod headphones; find a compromise. Of course this is if you care that much. you won't be able to make your track sound great on every single sound system.

Thank you for a very sensible suggestion, this is what I was thinking as well. I'm actually surprised at myself for not thinking of testing it on ear buds especially given how prolific they are now in today's society given portable devices.

milesahead wrote:it`s really hard to mix and master and have it sound good on any system.
and within 10 months, you won`t get there.
it will take you 10 years to become a good mastering engineer...

...don`t expect to be perfect from reading.
use your ears, if you listen on a system where your track doesn`t sound as you expect,
go back and try to adjust it.
listen again, and see if you were able to improove.
but, again: don`t expect too much.

Thank you again for very sensible advice. I just wanted to add about the 10 months part that music literally saved my life.

Previously I was racked by a harsh depression and lacked focus. Then my wife (who is a classically trained piano player) bought a keyboard that came with Live Lite. Well, I set it up for her and had a look, downloaded some free loops and let her play around.

But in the background I was putting the pieces together, so this is how they make dance music (and I have always been very fond of Trance).

I then found myself playing with Live more and more so we upgraded to Live (not suite). Since then I'm now learning piano (from a book but wife is a capable teacher) and the guitar as well. I now try to spend 30 mins to 1 hour a night studying mastering, mixing and reading my Computer Music magazines/doing tutorials.

Not long into the process I realized that I was so busy learning and so interested in the subject matter that the depression just disappeared. I am so VERY GRATEFUL for discovering music in my life and very grateful to those that help me improve my skills for this new passion!

^^ Live saved my life.

Nice.

Wish you all the best.

I also find it hard to afford mastering, but do the best I can.

Keep working at it. Listen & learn.

Sibanger wrote:^^ Live saved my life.

Nice.

Wish you all the best.

Live is Life. Ableton Life.

Sibanger wrote:^^ Live saved my life.

Nice.

Wish you all the best.

I also find it hard to afford mastering, but do the best I can.

Keep working at it. Listen & learn.

Thank you, I really appreciate your kindness!

I'm definitely going to keep at it, the entire music making process is so interesting!

ze2be wrote:

Sibanger wrote:^^ Live saved my life.

Nice.

Wish you all the best.

Live is Life. Ableton Life.

Thank you, really. And I love it, Ableton Life, brilliant!!