Ableton Forum

This is pretty setup-specific and kind of complicated, but I figured this was worth a shot. My goal is to play a Reason synth in Live by controlling filter freq with MIDI notes (I want to launch MIDI clips with an APC40 and control filter freq with my keyboard). I'm using the MAX4Live device External Instrument Control by prodavid: http://www.maxforlive.com/library/device.php?id=54

Since MIDI clips are already playing chords within the instrument track, I assumed that to do this I would need to route MIDI data from another track with a Reason ext inst; the problem is I don't know how to route this data into the target instruments' filter freq input in the back of the rack.

To sum up: I'm trying to use 2 tracks, one with the device and MIDI chords playing, and one with a "ghost" instrument whose MIDI data is being sent to the filter freq modulation input of the original instrument in the other track. I figured I'd first have to convert the MIDI note messages to CC, but in the back of the rack view in Reason, it looks like MIDI data can be transferred to and from only the sequencer section of an instrument, if it has one. So I've hit a brick wall.

I might be going about this the wrong way, but if I can somehow get this method of playing to work, it would be AWESOME.

I have mine set up similar. The part I don't understand:

My goal is to play a Reason synth in Live by controlling filter freq with MIDI notes

How so?

This is how it looks here:



In rewire mode I almost exclusively use combinators. I have a Live and a Reason template set up this way.

Basically what I want to do is the same as the "Semi-Random Filter Modulation By Sequencer" instructions that you can find on the back of Thor, except that instead of semi-random sequencer notes, I'm controlling the modulation myself with MIDI notes.

I'm 75% there- actually discovered you can route audio into Thor's built-in modules (so good to know), which sort of allows me to get 2 instances of MIDI data to the right device. Essentially a single fully-functioning Thor is split up into 2 Thors. So now 2 Thors with the same patch are connected together-- one contains the oscillators and pretty much nothing else; the other has the filters to be modulated. MIDI notes to generate sound get sent to the Oscillator Thor (triggered by MIDI clips in Live), whose audio gets routed to the Filter Thor, and in the Filter Thor Matrix I have:

Audio1 In > Filter1 In
MIDI Note > Filter Freq
MIDI Gate > Filter Env Gate** (should be off to get sequencer-modulation effect)

And it halfway works- I can use my APC40 to launch MIDI clips to generate sound (though it's unfortunate the pads aren't velocity-sensitive), and with my keyboard I can sort of control filter frequency. But I'm still not getting the sequencer-modulation sound that I'm looking for. Right now the amount of control is extremely limited- all this work is basically a complicated way of triggering envelopes and a rather clunky way to modulate filter frequency. Every time I press a key, the Filter Env gets re-triggered, which I know I don't want to happen every time, and I'm thinking the MIDI Gate routing is important and needs to be changed. I think how and when the Env Gates get triggered is crucial.

What's more, Even with all the parameters the same as if I were using one normal Thor with the same patch, the sound that comes out seems muddier and quieter. It needs some work, and I'm not entirely sure where to make changes. Any ideas?

My apologies- this would probably be a lot easier to understand with a screengrab. I'll try that when I get the chance.

mothergarage wrote:I have mine set up similar. The part I don't understand:

My goal is to play a Reason synth in Live by controlling filter freq with MIDI notes

How so?

This is how it looks here:



In rewire mode I almost exclusively use combinators. I have a Live and a Reason template set up this way.

Edit: Just figured out half the trigger issue; simply had to switch the Filter Thor to mono legato keyboard mode after turning off Gate Trigger of the Amp and Filter Env. In the Oscillator Thor, MIDI Gate > CV Out1, which is routed to CV In1 of Filter Thor. To trigger envelopes: CV In1 > Amp Env Gate, Filter Env Gate.

However, there is still no sound being generated when I press a pad on the APC40, only when I press a key. But, when I press different pads that launch MIDI clips with different chords, and I'm holding a key down, the Filter Thor detects the note changes. At least with mono legato mode on, I'm able to sidestep the envelopes retriggering issue.

So now I'm almost there, I'm just not sure how to hear sound from just launching MIDI clips in Live as opposed to also having to press a key-- it would be nice to have a passive continuous pad sound underneath all the filter frequency modulation.

Something like this?