Ableton Forum

I didn't know what board to post this in, I also have it post on NI's forum but I rarely get responses there.


So a few days ago I decided to reformat my computer and start "fresh" before installing multiple VST plugins I recently purchased. I had Komplete 8 on my machine before that and I have it back on there now. While installing Komplete 8 I noticed each disc was under the 4.7gb single layer disc capacity and thought to myself "I could make a backup of all these in case some sh*t happens to them." I have all my downloaded software setups backed up to an external HD as well as to disc. Komplete 8 is the only software that I bought physical discs of as there isn't really another option as well as because download times would be ludicrous.

My problem though is that the initial install disc uses a dual layer disc which has a capacity of up to 8.5gb. I want to know if it is possible to split that onto 2 single layer discs? BUT! I want to make the discs bootable..? I want them to work just as they do out of the box. I do not want to split the disc into 2 .daa partitions then burn to 2 discs. If I did it that way I would have to put the files onto the computer then mount them and begin installation.

I can create an ISO of each disc and just mount and install that way but I want to have them on physical discs, that's a pet peeve of mine. I was looking at the contents of disc 1 and I figure if I can't split it among 2 discs and it be bootable, I could take some of it and burn to 1 disc and the rest to another disc then just put those files onto the computer in the same folder before running installation.

My main reason for doing this, besides making backups, is that I am going to be purchasing another computer which will be my primary music production machine and this one will become secondary. I want to keep a set of discs with each machine (they will be at 2 different locations).

Any help would be appreciated, thanks.

Do you have a dual layer DVD burner? Wouldn't it be easier to just create the first disk as a dual layer and the rest as single?

Personally, I hate DVD backups even of other DVDs. I would prefer to create an ISO and mount any day. That way I can store on my backup drive and that can be easily copied to another drive. Shit, you could even just place on a USB stick or 2 instead of DVDs if you need a portable copy.

For all the hassle of trying to split and make it work etc, just create ISO image and place on HDD or USB storage or get a blueray burner and place all on that.

jestermgee wrote:Do you have a dual layer DVD burner? Wouldn't it be easier to just create the first disk as a dual layer and the rest as single?

Personally, I hate DVD backups even of other DVDs. I would prefer to create an ISO and mount any day. That way I can store on my backup drive and that can be easily copied to another drive. Shit, you could even just place on a USB stick or 2 instead of DVDs if you need a portable copy.

For all the hassle of trying to split and make it work etc, just create ISO image and place on HDD or USB storage or get a blueray burner and place all on that.

The point of all of this was to work with what I have. DVD/CD backup is the safer way to backup as HDs crash, happened to me before but 4 year old dvd backups saved my ass. I have already considered the options you have provided. The market for dual layer discs aren't too great either from what I've experienced. Many brands available have pretty shoddy quality discs while I've had the same brand single layer discs last until intentionally destroyed. If I had the money though, I would have a few Western Digital "Passport" drives. I have a 1tb model and its fuckin' tiny compared to my other, older, 500gb WD drive. I do backup to those HDs but like I said the discs are safer, kind of a safety net for me.

What do you use for your ISO mounter?

Thanks for your response!

I use Daemon Tools Lite, does what it needs too.

In regards to backups, I have managed backups for decades and I can agree that a good quality DVD can be a good backup but with data these days and the cost of a USB stick, backing up 32gb in 15 minutes as opposed to 8 x 25 minutes is reason enough. Even a good disk can have a write error or suffer a scratch. The trick for backups is to not rely on 1 backup. Hdd prices are so cheap nowadays you can just invest in 2 drives for important stuff and mirror them.

If DVDs really are your only option I would still just ISO the first disk and split over 2 volumes with a zip utility. If its just a backup it really only matters a bit in the event you need it then as long as it works that's the main thing,

I originally installed the content portion to an external hard drive. I recently had to install Komplete on a new computer and selected to only install the instruments (first disc only, woot!)...then I just copied the content over to my internal drive and relinked each instrument to its library. It was involved relinking each instrument but it was a hell of a lot faster than reinstalling the whole thing.

jestermgee wrote:I use Daemon Tools Lite, does what it needs too.

In regards to backups, I have managed backups for decades and I can agree that a good quality DVD can be a good backup but with data these days and the cost of a USB stick, backing up 32gb in 15 minutes as opposed to 8 x 25 minutes is reason enough. Even a good disk can have a write error or suffer a scratch. The trick for backups is to not rely on 1 backup. Hdd prices are so cheap nowadays you can just invest in 2 drives for important stuff and mirror them.

If DVDs really are your only option I would still just ISO the first disk and split over 2 volumes with a zip utility. If its just a backup it really only matters a bit in the event you need it then as long as it works that's the main thing,

I know what you mean about the price. When i got my old WD HD it was $250 for 500gb and currently the 1tb Hd only cost $100. I honestly would like to get another HD and mirror them but I am broke! I'm currently in college taking courses for electrical engineering as well as some music courses. I bought the plugins I recently got to use for the "at home" projects our professor has assigned. That was all pretty expensive even with the EDU discount on each. This semester I've paid the most I ever have for books, lab fees, and supplies than I ever have. The only money I have left is being saved for a new computer and my phone bill. Definitely will buy another HD when I have the opportunity though.

BTW, if anyone hasn't noticed, you can download the ISOs of Komplete in your NI account.

kitekrazy wrote:BTW, if anyone hasn't noticed, you can download the ISOs of Komplete in your NI account.

Not if you have Ultimate, but the HDD is SOoooooooo much worth the extra few dollars (only 699 at the moment)

I know what you mean about the price. When i got my old WD HD it was $250 for 500gb and currently the 1tb Hd only cost $100. I honestly would like to get another HD and mirror them but I am broke! I'm currently in college taking courses for electrical engineering as well as some music courses. I bought the plugins I recently got to use for the "at home" projects our professor has assigned. That was all pretty expensive even with the EDU discount on each. This semester I've paid the most I ever have for books, lab fees, and supplies than I ever have. The only money I have left is being saved for a new computer and my phone bill. Definitely will buy another HD when I have the opportunity though.

Ha... I remember my first Windows PC (Windows 95) which I bought second hand for $800 with money I saved from my first job:

P133
16GB Ram
20GB HDD
4x CD Rom (not a burner or DVD)
VGA Graphics.

If DVDs are the only way to make a backup then go that way. You can look around for some programs that will allow you to make ISO backups over multiple disks. I would try and save though (instead of buying plugins ) for a backup solution if you don't already have one because that will prove very important if you have anything you care about on a HDD.

Here's a story: I upgraded a PC one day just to add another HDD. It was my main PC with everything on it (My music projects, photos, 15 years worth of documents and files etc). After I aded the new drive and switched on the computer, some smoke shot out of the box somewhere and the PC shutdown. I discovered that one of the SATA cables along with a 12v power lead had become crushed in the chassis and created a short between 12v, ground and the SATA data cable. this destroyed everything connected to the SATA bus including 4 hard drives, rom drive and the motherboard itself. The motherboard was still warranty which was lucky but all drives were destroyed. Had this of been a RAID machine and my only source of backup I would have lost 15 years of my life. It was not though an I had an automated backup system to my server and to external drives. I lost nothing but some time and money which is fine in the scheme of things.

I learnt when I first started with computers to invest as much time in a good backup solution as anything else and to this day I still have lost nothing.

New Cloud backup solutions are a much more desirable solution but I have had issues there too with dodgy servers and sites that overnight loose everyone's files through a glitch or change or something. Don't fully rely on an online solution either. Put it all in many baskets. I have a lot to say on this subject because I have watched people break right down after loosing irreplaceable data and now with kids of my own I would hate to loose their birth, 1st bday, 1st steps etc because of a HDD crash and no backups.

jestermgee wrote:Put it all in many baskets.

That's one of my reaons for wanting to backup to physical disc. I currently have that 500gb drive, 1tb drive and a 40gb drive. Everything on the 500gb and 1tb is mirrored. The 40gb is more for tranfering from computer to computer without using my backup drives. The one time my laptop crashed I freaked. I learned the importance of backing up your data at that moment years ago. Luckily, the drive wasnt the problem and and I was able to recover everything I wanted from the drive with the help of another computer.