Ableton Forum

Hey all,

I need some guidance on how to properly layer kicks. I've got a nice sounding 808 in massive with a synth kick on one of the oscillators and the bass on the other. I want to layer an even punchier kick sample on top of this bass line to really make it hit hard. I've read a bunch of forums and websites regarding how to EQ these kicks but I don't understand how to properly layer two kicks and/or a kick and an 808 bass sound. They would of course be on separate tracks, and I can line them up so the kicks play at the same time but this causes phase issues. From what I understand it is basically like combining the waveforms of the two kicks/kick and bass so that they don't sound like crap together? how would you layer them on separate tracks in ableton? THANKS!!!

may you should try the utility from the audioeffects to change the phase of one tracks sound

How do you do that with utility? Thanks

Or could someone just explain how they layer kicks and 808's? Thanks

I would use an instrument rack embedded in a drum rack. Drag an instrument rack to your kick drum in the drum rack. Now you have unlimited channels. I would use simpler's to load samples. This gives you a lot more control in the long run. You could do things with seperate 'output' tracks using a single midi track for input to those tracks as well.
The nice thing about the instrument rack is the ability to save your layered kit.

So once you do what you said, you'll have the kicks playing at exactly the same time? How do you get them to "double-up" or really mesh together? Is that just an EQ thing? THANKS!!

Here is a screen shot of what I'm trying to do. The massive 808 + kick track is pictured with the track below I'm trying to layer...

SPH1185 wrote:Hey all,

I need some guidance on how to properly layer kicks. I've got a nice sounding 808 in massive with a synth kick on one of the oscillators and the bass on the other. I want to layer an even punchier kick sample on top of this bass line to really make it hit hard. I've read a bunch of forums and websites regarding how to EQ these kicks but I don't understand how to properly layer two kicks and/or a kick and an 808 bass sound. They would of course be on separate tracks, and I can line them up so the kicks play at the same time but this causes phase issues. From what I understand it is basically like combining the waveforms of the two kicks/kick and bass so that they don't sound like crap together? how would you layer them on separate tracks in ableton? THANKS!!!

Get the basic ideas here:
Get your kicks with Rob Papen’s Punch-BD bangin’ bass drum virtual instrument

The same ideas apply to any kind of layering.
Layering can also mean velocity layering so that one kick leaves off space for another at a higher or lower velocity range. Don't think EQ only, also investigate dynamic filtering and side-chaining.
Also investigate using a second kick or completely other types of sounds, especially in the attack phase.

SPH1185 wrote:Here is a screen shot of what I'm trying to do. The massive 808 + kick track is pictured with the track below I'm trying to layer...

What's the reason that the massive 808 kick is on an audio track here? While you could convert audio to MIDI and trigger additional sound with that, it does seem overly complicated unless there is a really good reason.

I froze it and flattened it

Here's a pretty good tutorial on layering kicks, by Quantize.

*bookmark*

Stromkraft wrote:

SPH1185 wrote:Here is a screen shot of what I'm trying to do. The massive 808 + kick track is pictured with the track below I'm trying to layer...

What's the reason that the massive 808 kick is on an audio track here? While you could convert audio to MIDI and trigger additional sound with that, it does seem overly complicated unless there is a really good reason.

How would I trigger additional sound if I unfreeze and unflatten it? Can you explain what you mean by this? Thanks

SPH1185 wrote:

Stromkraft wrote:

SPH1185 wrote:Here is a screen shot of what I'm trying to do. The massive 808 + kick track is pictured with the track below I'm trying to layer...

What's the reason that the massive 808 kick is on an audio track here? While you could convert audio to MIDI and trigger additional sound with that, it does seem overly complicated unless there is a really good reason.

How would I trigger additional sound if I unfreeze and unflatten it? Can you explain what you mean by this? Thanks

As have already been described in the Thread use an instrument rack containing the samples / sound within a drum rack.