Push 3 external device program changes

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tumblz
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Push 3 external device program changes

Post by tumblz » Wed May 24, 2023 5:08 pm

With the Push 3 in standalone mode, can I change presets/patches and banks on external devices via program change MIDI messages? In the current manual, I don't see any indication that you can make program changes in the clip options. I am guessing program changes can be made on a laptop/desktop version of Live and then exported to standalone. But obviously that's a time-consuming workaround.

[jur]
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by [jur] » Wed May 24, 2023 5:12 pm

You guessed it. Do it in Live and then export to Push.
A M4L device could probably solve the issue though.
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tumblz
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by tumblz » Wed May 24, 2023 10:36 pm

Hopefully this gets added in a future update. I'm sure there are hundreds of these inaccessible Live features. But with this particular feature, for about an hour of coding it would make Push 3 a lot more competitive against Squarp Hapax, Novation SL3, and anything that does program changes.

For most people, "standalone" means bye-bye laptop. Needing the laptop to change external device settings means it's not fully standalone yet. But very close.

tobypike
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by tobypike » Thu May 25, 2023 6:34 am

Yes @ableton, please add this to the Push 3. I've purchased the Push 3 in replacement of my Octatrack, this seems to be the only feature that is falling short.

PROGRAM CHANGE FROM PUSH 3 NECESSARY!

[jur]
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by [jur] » Thu May 25, 2023 11:27 am

As I said, look up on maxforlive.com and download a device that sends PC by turning a knob or something and you'll be good to go.
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tumblz
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by tumblz » Fri May 26, 2023 3:50 pm

For flipping through a few presets, adding an M4L program device is a practical workaround. That said, I hope this won't be interpreted as a "fix".

Imagine if Ableton announced that all future preset changes for Operator and Wavetable would have to be done through a separate M4L device. People would flip out, right? Even though that might be a "practical" approach, it isn't an optimal approach.

Ableton is an exciting and inspiring brand precisely because of its efficient and refined workflow. This feature would be easy to add and would pay for itself. Seems like it would be worth adding to the feature request list. Doesn't Mad Zach, in the promo video, want to control the presets on that Hydrasynth without an extra M4L device? Lol.

binarysun
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by binarysun » Fri May 26, 2023 10:50 pm

[jur] wrote:
Thu May 25, 2023 11:27 am
As I said, look up on maxforlive.com and download a device that sends PC by turning a knob or something and you'll be good to go.
Is there any that is working? I tried all I could find (4) and none is working really. Having program changes in standalone is quite an essential thing for me.

binarysun
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by binarysun » Sat May 27, 2023 12:04 am

[jur] wrote:
Thu May 25, 2023 11:27 am
As I said, look up on maxforlive.com and download a device that sends PC by turning a knob or something and you'll be good to go.
Is there any that is working? I tried all I could find (4) and none is working really. Having program changes in standalone is quite an essential thing for me.

I tried this Program Change M4L http://maxforlive.com/library/device/40 ... am-changer and put it into a group and mapped the dials to macros. This works very well in Controller Mode of Push 3 but when I copy the rack over and open it in standalone mode, then the macros are empty again and also push complains that it cannot find the plugin showing my local macOS path which indeed is not existent on the Push. Any idea how to fix that?

EDIT: I shouldn't edit forum posts at night. sorry for the double post :oops:

[jur]
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by [jur] » Sat May 27, 2023 12:58 am

Did you copy the device in Push's User Library first?
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binarysun
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by binarysun » Sat May 27, 2023 5:30 pm

I tried different ways. Copy everything to the Ableton user library first, drag the prog change m4v directly the the group. And so much more that I lost the overview at some point. Could you detail the correct way of grouping a m4l plugin, map macros and put to the push please?

binarysun
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by binarysun » Sat May 27, 2023 11:44 pm

Alright, took my limited knowledge of m4l and slightly edited tr3b's device to who all controls on the Push 3.

It can be found here. Just download to Push and enjoy
https://maxforlive.com/library/device.php?id=9212

Rituun
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by Rituun » Sun Jun 11, 2023 10:30 pm

Thanks, this great, pretty cool to see users doing the job ABleton is not doing correctly ( yet hopefully)
to me prg change is a very needed basic ( coming from hardware synths) . so far I don't succeed to make it work on push 3 standalone, but I guess mistake is on my side as I'm just starting the whole push and live journey

dest4b
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by dest4b » Mon Jun 12, 2023 11:38 am

i had already created a userrequest @ Ableton. but this maxx4live thing does the job.
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TheLoudest
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by TheLoudest » Mon Jun 26, 2023 7:42 pm

I've downloaded this m4L device but there seems to be something I'm missing...how do you program your PC/MSB/LSB for a whole midi clip?

I tried to set an automation with the step sequencer but it only changes the program on that step and returns to the previous setting...
I must be doing something wrong :lol:

btw I imagine it would be possible to make an m4l device with the list of presets from our external synths, right? (I mean directly with the names)
and in the background it would send the PC/MSB/LSB messages corresponding to the selected preset

it would be much more "user friendly" :) we could manage external device presets as easily as "plug-in presets".

BSA
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Re: Push 3 external device program changes

Post by BSA » Fri Jun 30, 2023 12:48 pm

I'm considering getting a P3S to replace my Octatrack in my live setup, but as another user in this thread mentions MIDI Program Changes to external devices are essential to me. It seems there are some work arounds atm using M4L. After a couple weeks, how stable are these? I have read about the P3S crashing and am doing some assumptions that using M4L patches increases that risk.

My main use case would be to set up PG changes in Live Desktop. Editing them on the P3S would be a nice to have, but not essential for me now. I expect Ableton to patch this into the interface sometime if it is supported under the hood.
Does the P3S respect PG changes saved in MIDI clips on desktop? As mentioned by OP?

Looking at the manual MIDI Program Change messages are not mentioned. This kind of concerns me.
https://www.ableton.com/en/push/manual/ ... s%20remote

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