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PostPosted: Fri Nov 18, 2005 11:03 pm 

Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2003 10:23 pm
Posts: 453
Location: Dallas, TX
Bump-ola.

I seriously want to know what the abes are going to do about it because I don't know if I should be a beefy single processor or way cool dual core as my next purchase.

I mean, if I'll never be able to take advantage of dual cpu's, it really doesn't pay to buy one.

I simple "we're working onit" or "not gonna happen" would be nice. I don't care about a date, just want to know if its ever going to happen.

/drez

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2005 1:41 am 

Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2005 10:41 pm
Posts: 8
Location: norway
YES YES YES!!! this is a must!,as most serios DAW software these days allready support this feature.Even the "one man" app podium supports it (great app by the way).

It doesn't help that the second cpu helps out with the GUI,when the main cpu start sweating out all it's power!

Please give us any feedback on this!

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 3:24 am 

Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 5:05 am
Posts: 50
Location: Quebec City, Canada
Sunburzt wrote:
YES YES YES!!! this is a must!,as most serios DAW software these days allready support this feature.Even the "one man" app podium supports it (great app by the way).

It doesn't help that the second cpu helps out with the GUI,when the main cpu start sweating out all it's power!

Please give us any feedback on this!


Here is all the feedback (if any) that you will receive from Ableton on this subject:
:oops: :roll: :oops: :roll: :oops: :roll: :oops: :roll:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 8:19 am 

Joined: Tue Jul 27, 2004 11:05 am
Posts: 155
Location: no(r)way
xl5 wrote:
Here is all the feedback (if any) that you will receive from Ableton on this subject:
:oops: :roll: :oops: :roll: :oops: :roll: :oops: :roll:


LOL :lol: - Too bad it's true... :evil:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 2:08 pm 

Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2005 2:05 pm
Posts: 425
Location: Italy
Please everyone stop ranting on Ableton not giving any feedback about multithreading support.

Here is a post from Alex:

http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... highlight=

Quote:
Hi Dr. Zoiberg,

I can only provide a "marketing like" answer "It is on our list".
But when and how it will come I can not yet say.

regards,
Alex


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 2:27 pm 

Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2004 6:26 am
Posts: 2133
Location: Orlando FL
Dr. Zoiberg wrote:
Please everyone stop ranting on Ableton not giving any feedback about multithreading support.

Here is a post from Alex:

http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... highlight=

Quote:
Hi Dr. Zoiberg,

I can only provide a "marketing like" answer "It is on our list".
But when and how it will come I can not yet say.

regards,
Alex



yes, i think someone also commented they were holding back because the mactel thing changes everything. do a search
.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 2:43 pm 

Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2004 6:26 am
Posts: 2133
Location: Orlando FL
xl5 wrote:
forge wrote:
dont worry, you really can rest assured the silence is because they are working their arses off....


Frankly, whether or not Alex is around makes no difference at all. Even when Alex made interventions on this forum, he never made one about multi-threading. The subject of multiple processor support didn't just start with this thread. It's been a problem for a while now and Ableton never commented on it.



no, they did. i believe it was robert henke. search.
.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 4:42 pm 

Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 5:05 am
Posts: 50
Location: Quebec City, Canada
Dr. Zoiberg wrote:

Please everyone stop ranting on Ableton not giving any feedback about multithreading support.

Here is a post from Alex:

http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... highlight=

Quote:
Hi Dr. Zoiberg,

I can only provide a "marketing like" answer "It is on our list".
But when and how it will come I can not yet say.

regards,
Alex


xl5 wrote:
…But they probably won't come out and say "Don't wait for this as it's not gonna happen soon". Why? Because a lot of people, including me, would start thinking that the future of music making won't include Live in their set up anymore. So business wise its a better move for them to keep radio silence on the matter…


Here we are again, we must have broke a record. A full two pages in this thread before an intervention from someone from Ableton groupies planet. I've had it with these silly and empty : " Stop doing this to the Abes. They're the best and will always be. Please stoooooooooooop, I love them, they're so cooooooooool"

I'm a fool because I though this was a forum of Live users. Here on heart, everybody not wearing Ableton pijams to bed thought we could ask REAL and SERIOUS questions that whether you like it or not remain UNANSWERED. Is this forum some sort of fanzine or fan club disscussion group? Is it? From were I stand we all like and respect Ableton Live as an incredible writing tool. If that was not the case why would I spend any time here anyway?

Seriously now, YES, you're right, this statement from Alex DID passed me by. But then again, it is still the kind of empty and generic insult to our intelligence comment that I predicted (backward?) they would make. It tells you ABSOLUTLY NOTHING. It leaves you exactly were you were before his statement:
COMPLETLY IN THE DARK.
Information content : NONE.

Ableton has a lot of serious issues to address if they don't want Live to become an hobbyist application. I will repeat this as long as it will remain true : Live is lagging behind and its power processing usage is unnaceptable compare to other DAWs. Professional users using Live everyday to earn a living NEED an intelligent and highly informative answers on multi-processor support NOW to plan their PRESENT and FUTURE investements.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 5:17 pm 

Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2005 2:05 pm
Posts: 425
Location: Italy
They clearly stated that multithreading is going to be implemented into Ableton Live.
INFORMATION CONTENT: it's coming.

Try asking Apple when they will fix some old, old bugs in Logic, and you'll see who laves you completely in the dark.

Look, I want multithreading badly.
I own a dual G5 and I was a former Logic pro user, so I know what i'm missing.
But I also know why I have switched from Logic to Live, so I don't mind if I have to wait a bit for multithreading support, because I already have a much better workflow and that is more important to me than loading 100+ plug-ins.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 7:47 pm 

Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 5:05 am
Posts: 50
Location: Quebec City, Canada
Dr. Zoiberg wrote:
They clearly stated that multithreading is going to be implemented into Ableton Live.
INFORMATION CONTENT: it's coming.

Try asking Apple when they will fix some old, old bugs in Logic, and you'll see who laves you completely in the dark.

Look, I want multithreading badly.
I own a dual G5 and I was a former Logic pro user, so I know what i'm missing.
But I also know why I have switched from Logic to Live, so I don't mind if I have to wait a bit for multithreading support, because I already have a much better workflow and that is more important to me than loading 100+ plug-ins.


Would you be kind enough to tell me were exactly he stated: IT'S COMMING?
Because all I can remember are things like "I cannot yet say". I understand that you said this answer was enough for you but please don't make what it's not.
"It's on our list" and " It's coming" are VERY different statement honnestly. We don't even have a clue as to where it is on their list? At the top, at the bottom?

I also own a dual G5 and I owned a dual G4 before that. I also use Logic and like I said before, as a songwriting tool, Live (4) is unbeatable at the moment. But even at that, version 5 made this process slower. Now, nobody here (I think, I hope) wants to load 100 plug-ins!!! A moderate song arrangement with 10 plug-ins (a couple of hi-quality reverbs) is very hard to accomplish using in Live 5 at this point. A "spikeless" professional arrangement in Live 5 is impossible even when using that buggy Freeze thing. THIS is why we are asking questions and THIS is why we need answers now. You consider that "it's on our list" is a clear and undeniable commitement on their part but I disagree. We need to know if they intend to make it part of the NEXT UPDATE or NEXT VERSION or LIVE 7 !!!.

I hope you don't suggest that comparing their attitude with Apple doesn't make Ableton attitude right. I understand that you WANT multi-threading happening as well, that's good. The problem is that a lot of us just NEED it. Since I don't have x-ray "It's on our list" still leaves me COMPLETLY IN THE DARK.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 8:57 pm 

Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 7:17 pm
Posts: 4733
Location: Indianapolis, USA
i'm kinda starting to like this single processor utilization limitation.

keeps me creative.




















:P

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 9:35 pm 

Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2005 2:05 pm
Posts: 425
Location: Italy
xl5 wrote:
Would you be kind enough to tell me were exactly he stated: IT'S COMMING?
Because all I can remember are things like "I cannot yet say". I understand that you said this answer was enough for you but please don't make what it's not.
"It's on our list" and " It's coming" are VERY different statement honnestly. We don't even have a clue as to where it is on their list? At the top, at the bottom?

I also own a dual G5 and I owned a dual G4 before that. I also use Logic and like I said before, as a songwriting tool, Live (4) is unbeatable at the moment. But even at that, version 5 made this process slower. Now, nobody here (I think, I hope) wants to load 100 plug-ins!!! A moderate song arrangement with 10 plug-ins (a couple of hi-quality reverbs) is very hard to accomplish using in Live 5 at this point. A "spikeless" professional arrangement in Live 5 is impossible even when using that buggy Freeze thing. THIS is why we are asking questions and THIS is why we need answers now. You consider that "it's on our list" is a clear and undeniable commitement on their part but I disagree. We need to know if they intend to make it part of the NEXT UPDATE or NEXT VERSION or LIVE 7 !!!.

I hope you don't suggest that comparing their attitude with Apple doesn't make Ableton attitude right. I understand that you WANT multi-threading happening as well, that's good. The problem is that a lot of us just NEED it. Since I don't have x-ray "It's on our list" still leaves me COMPLETLY IN THE DARK.


Do you really think that Ableton will implement multithreading in Live 7, now that every new cpu is multicore?
Do you think they want to miss all those sales?

IMHO, it will be in a future update to Live 5, or at last in Live 6.

By the way, I can load a lot of heavy plug-ins on my 2.3 ghz dual, even big convolution reverbs, but I don't use mLan.
I was a former Yamaha 01X user, and I found Motu drivers to be much lighter on the cpu and without all the hassle with yamaha drivers and not-so-auto connectors.
Try a different audio interface if you want better performance today.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:39 am 

Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 5:05 am
Posts: 50
Location: Quebec City, Canada
Dr. Zoiberg wrote:

Do you really think that Ableton will implement multithreading in Live 7, now that every new cpu is multicore?
Do you think they want to miss all those sales?
IMHO, it will be in a future update to Live 5, or at last in Live 6.


Your opinion, my opinion, they're all irrelevant. I don't make music out of opinions. What we need are not speculations or prédictions, what we need are facts. The only thing that both you and I know is that it's not here today.

Dr. Zoiberg wrote:
By the way, I can load a lot of heavy plug-ins on my 2.3 ghz dual, even big convolution reverbs, but I don't use mLan.
I was a former Yamaha 01X user, and I found Motu drivers to be much lighter on the cpu and without all the hassle with yamaha drivers and not-so-auto connectors.
Try a different audio interface if you want better performance today.


Well I'm very happy that you can do all that with your 2.3. So as of today you wouldn't know what to do with all that extra processing power. That you can mix more a typical 24 tracks song with convolution reverbs amazes me. But it makes me happy that you can.

The only reason why I chose the Yamaha interface is its price versus the quality of its preamps. As a former RME user, I couldn't keep with PCI since Apple adopted PCIe and of course there are no PCIe sound card on the market. So for the moment it's the i88x. I would certainly consider another non-firewire solution when it becomes available. But of course you know that you don't need your interface for mixing, so since all your inputs and outputs (except for your monitors) are turned off it doesn't suck any processing power of your CPU.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:57 am 

Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 5:05 am
Posts: 50
Location: Quebec City, Canada
AdamJay wrote:
i'm kinda starting to like this single processor utilization limitation.

keeps me creative.:P


Yes that's a very good point. And it is certainly a good way to look at music making. BUT. And there is always that damn BUT. Professionaly you very often have to meet certain expectations that are not always atainable with a creatively minimalist approach. I think it's a good approch but I'm pro-choice. I don't like to be put on a diet against my will. :wink:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2005 2:13 am 

Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 9:06 pm
Posts: 7472
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands
http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... highlight=

Robert Henke wrote:
Not entirely true. Currently the audio engine is one single thread, and can only run on one processor. But if you have a dual CPU machine, everything appart from the pure audio stuff runs on the other CPU, and this means you can max out one CPU for audio without slowing down the interface. This is a significant performance boost. As far as true multi threading is concerned I am quite sure some day you will see a Live version which runs on 10 CPUs if desired and available. ( No, this is not an official statement, this is just a prediction of what every software company which is doing CPU intensive realtime processing will have to do in the future since this is where computer architechture is heading to )


Robert Henke
Ableton


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