Ableton Forum

Im working in a pro-tools studio but i dont know how to use pro-tools. I wanna use LIVE but the soundcard they got is a DIGIDESIGN 8x8x8 24bit I/O. Will LIVE work independently with the 8x8x8 .

no

So when PRO-TOOLS users use LIVE they never use LIVE as a mic/line recorder ? They only use it for it's special abilities ?
I guess i'll have to learn some simple PRO TOOLS techniques and use the power of REWIRE.

Thanks for the quick reply !

Jon,

To address your question of ‘when PRO-TOOLS users use LIVE they never use LIVE as a mic/line recorder ?’

Any live user will record mics and line level instruments into live…but not with protools hardware. M-audio hardware for instance, would suffice. But protools users rarely use live for tracking.

Rewire is the real hero here. Propellerheads are the one’s who should be recognized.

if you look up proprietary in the dictionary, you'll find digidesign as the definition. what does that mean in terms of an 8x8x8. well, rewire is the only way to 'attach' live to protools. but when a user does that, it isn't through hardware, that's why it's called rewire (rewire is an interapplication communication protocol). however that doesn't mean you can’t still record into protools using the 8x8x8 simultaneously as you're recording into live. it only means that live will need it's own interface.

you see, when protools went (i think) version 3 or 4 (circa early 90's), the higher ups decided it would be in the stock holders best interest if the hardware and software was 'proprietary'. what does proprietary mean?

digidesign hardware only works with digidesign software.
you can't use digidesign hardware with live, or nuendo, or cubase, or fruity loops, or logic or premiere... et. al.

but somewhere along the lines of computer hardware and software development ( ram, hard drive space and processing power becoming cheaper + propellerhead's developing reason with rewire) the higher ups again decided (circa 2003) that protools needed to remain in the DAW market/game as the main competitor in every market from post production, DAW and studio recordings. SO they decided, since rewire is an 'open source' (free without licensing) protocol, it wouldn’t be so difficult to incorporate it into their next version of protools (ver. 5.x.x, i think) in order to off-set the complaints of users that wanted variety in their DAW software but be able to use the protools hardware they already purchased. there is one catch to this day. Protools is a rewire master. MEANING, it can't be a rewire slave. SO live records in protools and not vice versa. in this fashion there is no way to circumvent using protools hardware without using protools software.

however, recently (circa 2005) the higher ups at AVID (the company that owns digidesign) decided it was time again to stir things up in direct reaction to the fact companies like RME, M-Audio, MOTU, Edirol and the like we're cornering a market all for themselves... cheap audio interfaces. stuff with neutrik mic pres semi decent ad/da converters all at prosumer +4 db levels. this market encouraged young people new to recording, the next generation basically, to use 'cracked' DAWs off the internet and purchase used interfaces. this movement took away from AVIDs bottom line. so AVID bought the largest software independent interface manufacturer M-Audio and coupled a 'lite' version of protools 'm-powered'. although m-powered protools carries the digidesign logo it is limited in that only so many channels, stock effects are weak and premium effects like beat detective and the like are a no go. but as amateurs in the industry will tell you 'protools is protools'. And yet, in hindsight, this response served digidesigns purposes three fold.

people could no longer complain about digidesign hardware being proprietary. if you wanted to use protools but didn't want to buy a control 24 you could do that...and if down the line you got serious with recording...you wouldn't want to remain at an m-audio interface level anyway. the converters can only do some much and the pres can be noisy and unreliable. so the upgrade path was locked in place and pretty much guaranteed digidesign future business.

which in turn caused the next notion of the grander scheme. m-audio is an interesting purchase. where protools is steeped in traditional studio recording/DAW and post production, everything m-audio represents is in contrast to that. Bus-powered portable interfaces screams laptop and field recordings which is somewhere digidesign tried to venture out on their own with the m-box. but yet again with hardware and software developments (usb 1.1, usb 2.0, firewire 400 + 800, flash drives, DAWs like sonar, live, reason 3, and better softsynths all running on better laptops) digidesigns m-box developments and updates required so much attention to keep up with the market and competitors AVID found it easier to just purchase a company that was developing portable interfaces already; m-audio. Two-fold, digidesign could slow down resources on the m-box saving money AND remain relevant to new portable laptop recording markets bettering for stock holders the bottom line.

All this was put into place for one reason. Hollywood. As is stands now, protools is used in 80% of production houses in Hollywood; we’re talking every studio. Walt Disney, universal, dreamworks, sony, ilm, lucasfilm etc is using protools. Dollar for dollar, pound for pound, euro for euro there is more work in DAW/post production work than there is in studio recording work. And with every part of digidesigns plan functioning autonomously it freed up AVID to really make protools available to Hollywood, so that AVID could pretty much dominate the world in audio recording and post production.

How’s that for some “learnin’ you good”.

if you have particular rewire questions ask...

later.

i did tracking with my digi 001 and my digi 002r and live all the time
(without PT)
they worked great

no

hmmm... I just fired up Ableton 5.1 on my Pro Tools system without launching Pro Tools.

Go to preferences... select my 888/24 as the input/output. Configure them.

Works fine.

Does this not work for you?

It'll work on a Mac if Digidesign supply an OS X CoreAudio driver for the Digi hardware. On Windows, I guess you'd need a Digi ASIO or MME driver - does such a thing exist?

digi hardware is no longer proprietary...
screen shots please

record into live on a digi interface without protools open

take a screen shot of that and post it please.