Ableton Forum

hi! I just wanted to know if itworths to get reaktor session to use it for its effects with live...would it work? , is it bugy? . are the effects any good to use with live????...is there any good bundle of effects for mac osx???..I'm not looking for the regular effects such as reverb ...compressor..etc..

Forget reaktor, get the Max-Msp equivalent (soon, ohh so soon!):

http://www.cycling74.com/products/pluggo.html

Fricking sick, my friend.

Pluggo allows owners of max-msp to make plugins, many of which will be available for download outside of the official cycling 74 channels.

Here is a snippet that dropped my jaw:

Since all the plug-ins run within the same environment, they can work together behind the back of your sequencer. For example, the PluggoSync plug-in listens to an audio click track, then tells other plug-ins where the beat is. Then there's our PluggoBus system that lets plug-ins send up to eight channels of audio to each other, exploding the limitation of one or two outputs per plug-in in audio sequencers. pluggo also sports a set of Modulators--plug-ins that mess with the parameters of other plug-ins in cool and unusual ways. And VST and MAS users can even modulate the parameters of VST plug-ins that are not part of pluggo--see our Pluggo VST Host for an example.

These should be FAR less cpu intensive then any reaktor 4 patch.

I'm not really into making my own instruments and effects....thats why I was thinking about reaktor session.......

i use it in love and LOVE it all the way. Do it, you definitely wont regret it.....

Anonymous wrote:i use it in love and LOVE it all the way. Do it, you definitely wont regret it.....

that was meant to be 'i use it in 'live'

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:i use it in love and LOVE it all the way. Do it, you definitely wont regret it.....

that was meant to be 'i use it in 'live'

are you talking about reaktor session???...is any problem with live 3 on mac osx????....

I have heard many negetive comments about Reaktor Session in OS X. Apparenlty NI's Os X implementation leaves a lot to be desired. I would do some research to find out if RS is stable in OS X yet. I've done a little bit of reaserach and the answer that I came up with is that it is not ready yet.

Nathan

zebastian wrote:I'm not really into making my own instruments and effects....thats why I was thinking about reaktor session.......

Umm, where does it say you make your own instruments and effects.
Pluggo is to Max-Msp what Sessions is to Reaktor (i.e. IF you have max, you can MAKE pluggos, but if you only have pluggo you can use the 70+ pluggos that come with AND use what others create but CAN NOT make new ones). It's a win win situation, but feel free to pass up a good thing for bloatware anyday.

Forgot to say: Don't be stupid, check Joop's link**.

NI is a pc - centric company.

Cycling74 is mac all the way.

**His link takes you to a page that shows all the plugins that come with pluggo. These you do not have to build.

Heh - forgot to also say:

Max-Msp (the "language" of these plugins) is the original language LIVE was built in. All the Live effex were originally pluggos, in a sense (check monolakes website for evidence).

Don't be stupid, check that link. These are some of the weirdest and best plugins around, and more geared towards effex then sessions, I believe.

zebastian wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:i use it in love and LOVE it all the way. Do it, you definitely wont regret it.....

that was meant to be 'i use it in 'live'

are you talking about reaktor session???...is any problem with live 3 on mac osx????....

i meant session, but it is on a pc - shame to hear that about osx, I've been having a great time on win xp....

Malovox wrote:Heh - forgot to also say:

Max-Msp (the "language" of these plugins) is the original language LIVE was built in. All the Live effex were originally pluggos, in a sense (check monolakes website for evidence).

Don't be stupid, check that link. These are some of the weirdest and best plugins around, and more geared towards effex then sessions, I believe.

.
the only problem is that plugo isnt ready yet for osx... or .is it?????

just last month at the AES show, cycling 74 announced version 3.1, which is the mac os x/audio units release mac-heads have been waiting for.

http://aes.harmony-central.com/115AES/C ... -OS-X.html

this press release says it should be shipping in mid-november (already past), but you know how these things go...

i haven't heard of anywhere it's actually available yet, though.

anyone else have word on the pluggo 3.1 front?

n8

No, it is not available yet, but is sooo close, and so worthwhile, that you'd be silly to not wait the month for release (or wait *a* month for release - whichever is more applicable).

- JoOp.

Malovox - No need to be mean just to make a point, but I can see it's only your love of sharing something amazing that motivates your ways ..

To prevent this from becoming a one sided, let's examine the pro's and con's of each option.

Reaktor sessions:

pro) Many more plugins available for download then one will find *initially* for pluggo.

pro) Reaktor has a deep community that will continue this trend.

cons) No matter what, you can't edit the patches (and buying the full reaktor seems a redundency, you'll get a replacement not an expansion of service).

cons) Bloatware - I tried using some reaktor 4 demo patches in live, and they quickly blew my cpu meter bar out of the water. If you could edit the patches, you could at LEAST turn off some of the useless visuals.

cons) Pc-Centric company that can't seem to make stable software for mac (historically and currently, regarding reaktor till 4.0.4, intakt, sessions, kompakt, etc).

cons) In relation to pluggo, instances can't reference each other (i.e. patches can't cross modulate).

cons) Insane copy-protection according to a krv-vst.com review (CD AND challenge/response at every startup).

cons) Fewer effex plugins out of the box (made up for by access to the user libraries).

From kvr-vst

The lib installed from CD (probably the same shipped with Reaktor 4) includes 9 synthesizers, 4 sequenced synths, 4 samplers/transformers, 2 live tools and 9 effects. I do some of them like more, some less, but now I'm not restricted to a limited small selection. You now have access to a huge collection of Reaktor ensembles from others and the NI page. Besides the "Premium Lib", shipped with Dynamo and Reaktor 2, and those new with Reaktor 3, you can find as a registered user currently over 1300 user contribs for download there.

Pluggo:

Pros) Mac-Centric Company (www.cycling74.com).

Pros) Patches CAN cross modulate.

Pros) More pluggos out of the box.

Pros) Pluggos made by others can be added to your bundle, and acquired for free (potentially).

Pros) IF you eventually decide to become a programmer, you can purchase max-msp and not reiterate any of your current ability (i.e. pluggo expands max if you have it, and still rocks if you don't).

Pro) It has yet to be seen how they run on X, but the interfaces for the pluggos tend to be FAR less cpu intensive then Reaktor, so you should be able to load more into a set (this is also assuming their code works efficiently, and that the runtime enviroment/shell doesn't muck things up a bit).


cons) Far less pluggos available on the net due to a) the higher difficulty of max-msp (smaller community) and b) it doesn't exist yet... yet.

cons) Pluggo were well known to behave oddly in certain hosts, Live being one of them ironically (see the Pluggo tutorial on this site). This may, but probably won't, be an issue today with xpluggo.