Ableton Forum

I use Live in an environment where I need to play one or more audio clips repeatedly in an ad-hoc fashion. These clips represent sound FX, and have no inherent tempo or pitch information; I want them to retain their original length & pitch regardless of how the tempo of the overall set changes. In other words, I just want to be able to set a clip playing and have it loop repeatedly until I stop it. But I can't work out how to do it.

Now, I'm a relative newcomer to Live, and I might well be missing something blindingly obvious, but I have not found any way to do what I want. If I want to loop a clip, then I have to engage Warp, which is not appropriate for these clips (because they are not "loops" in the traditional sense - they're just sounds that I want to play repeatedly). I also tried using Follow Actions, but, again, they have a reliance on a tempo-based paradigm which is simply not appropriate for these clips.

Can anybody ease my pain & tell me how to achieve the results that I need?

Or is it the case that Live, for all its Warped sophistication, is currently unable to perform the seemingly trivial task of repeatedly playing a chunk of audio without changing either its pitch or tempo?

I guess that what I'm really asking is: is it possible to Loop without Warp? And if not, why not, and can you make that an option, please, Ableton?

Cheers,
Tony

tonysawford wrote: I guess that what I'm really asking is: is it possible to Loop without Warp? And if not, why not, and can you make that an option, please, Ableton?

Cheers,
Tony

Technically, no. But that does not mean that it's impossible to do what you want.

There is a huge thread called 'looping without warp' or something, filled with arguments, which you may or may not want to read

Basically, unless you're changing tempo, you can have warp on for these clips, in repitch or beats mode, without changing their sound at all.

You might look into playing sounds in a Simpler or Sampler - might be some options there

longjohns wrote:There is a huge thread called 'looping without warp' or something, filled with arguments, which you may or may not want to read

Yes, I did see that after I posted my message, but I must admit that I didn't read it all the way through, as it seemed to evolve into a discussion about whether warping altered sound quality or not, rather than whether it is possible to loop without warping...

longjohns wrote:Basically, unless you're changing tempo, you can have warp on for these clips, in repitch or beats mode, without changing their sound at all.

True, but that scheme falls apart as soon as you start monkeying with the tempo.

longjohns wrote:You might look into playing sounds in a Simpler or Sampler - might be some options there

Tried that, but it doesn't really help.

If it really is the case that warping and looping are intimately linked, as your post seems to confirm, then the lack of a simple "repeat play" mode for audio clips seems an absolutely astonishing gap in Live's functionality.

Cheers!

i agree that it is strange (though i'm sure there's a good technical excplanation) that
Live cannot prestinely loop a sound without breaking it down in Warp mode. and i also
confess that this idea has keptme from using Live in my work, as it envolves a fair amount of material that is inappropriate to "warp".

it's also true that you can't do fades without "warping".

but lately i've found that if you just leave the master tempo alone, and if the need arises, change the tempo/iptch WITHIN the individual clip, i can play these clips with great aplomb. without noticable degradation.

and the degradation is always there if i want to dial it in...
(which is a behavior i may have to keep in check... )

i WOULD love it if Ableton made it possible to loop and fade whilst leaving
the files warp-less. for theory's and hi-fi's sake.

You're going to have to workaround in the meantime if you need to be changing tempo.

Maybe:

At original tempo, activate warp and loop in repitch

in Arrange, drag out the clip end to some very long length. (creating "loops")

Consolidate

Turn off warp

I completely agree... it is unbelievable that we can't still not loop a clip without warping. We have been asking this feature from Live 2 (at least for m). There are bulky workarounds that take a lot of time and efforts...

tonysawford wrote:

longjohns wrote:

longjohns wrote:You might look into playing sounds in a Simpler or Sampler - might be some options there

Tried that, but it doesn't really help.

I'm using live for same sorts of means, in theatre etc.
So if I need to play a sound repeatedly without altering it's tempo&pitch, I use Simpler. Could you explain why it didn't work for your purposes? You can draw a midi note just the length of your sample and the leave it looping. Just don't use grids, select the loop area manually so it fits perfectly with the audio sample in use.

Maybe I misunderstood something, but hey that's what internet's all about.

-kimmo

i don't use Live the way you do but like the previous poster I was going to suggest using simpler to achieve what you described as it loops but does not repitch if the tempo changes...

kmodig wrote:I'm using live for same sorts of means, in theatre etc.
So if I need to play a sound repeatedly without altering it's tempo&pitch, I use Simpler. Could you explain why it didn't work for your purposes? You can draw a midi note just the length of your sample and the leave it looping. Just don't use grids, select the loop area manually so it fits perfectly with the audio sample in use.

Maybe I misunderstood something, but hey that's what internet's all about.

I agree that the approach that you describe works *provided* that you don't alter the set's tempo. If you do, then the length of the MIDI clip (in terms of time, rather than bars and beats) will be altered, and the sample will be retriggered at the wrong time. At least, that's what happened when I tried it.

I need the flexibility of being able to vary a set's tempo, without having to worry about whether it will affect the length / pitch of these clips.

I've reached the conclusion that the least ugly workround is to use an audio editor (probably Wavelab) to do some manual repetitions of the clips that I want to play repeatedly & create new clips that are longer than I could ever possibly need (which, of course, guarantees that they won't be long enough...) and just play them as one-shot clips, and forget all about this silly looping nonsense...

Thanks for all the input, guys!

To be clear, that can be done in Live, no need for Wavelab unless you want to.

The Mysterious Flying Pum wrote:it is unbelievable that we can't still not loop a clip without warping. We have been asking this feature from Live 2 (at least for m). There are bulky workarounds that take a lot of time and efforts...

its not that unbelievable really, how exactly would you implement it? How would live be able to know the tempo?

longjohns wrote:To be clear, that can be done in Live, no need for Wavelab unless you want to.

Yes, I realise that - I just prefer to use Wavelab, because that's an environment that I'm comfortable with, having used it since version 1.0.

Cheers,

Meef Chaloin wrote:

The Mysterious Flying Pum wrote:it is unbelievable that we can't still not loop a clip without warping. We have been asking this feature from Live 2 (at least for m). There are bulky workarounds that take a lot of time and efforts...

its not that unbelievable really, how exactly would you implement it? How would live be able to know the tempo?

But *my* original point is that tempo and pitch are absolutely irrelevant for the kinds of clip that I'm interested in. All I want Live to do is play the audio file from its start to its end, and then play it again, and again, and again.... until I tell it to stop. I'm absolutely not interested in doing anything clever, like making it match the tempo or pitch of other clips.

It's not exactly rocket surgery...

Meef Chaloin wrote:

The Mysterious Flying Pum wrote:it is unbelievable that we can't still not loop a clip without warping. We have been asking this feature from Live 2 (at least for m). There are bulky workarounds that take a lot of time and efforts...

its not that unbelievable really, how exactly would you implement it? How would live be able to know the tempo?

Why should Live have to know a sample's tempo when you want to use the sample to something free of sequencer?

A Yamaha SU200 Sampler which I just bought for 100 euros can do this. You know, just set the start and end point and, err, loop and play. No matter what the tempo is.

And, now that I tried it: that's the best way to do it in Live also. Use Simpler. Just program the sound you want to a midi key say A4, and then keep that A4 down when you hustle around with tempos etc. The tempo or pitch does not change nor does the start and end point of your loop.

Was this the case?

why doesn't follow action get you what you want?