Ableton Forum

just a moment ago I was working on a remix and Live disappeared from the screen (it seems to be crashed) when I was using it for some time in combination with Reason 2.5. Because of this Reason was 'hangin' since it was running in rewire-mode so I 'end task' it.

I needed to reboot the systeem because of this.

I am using RME Hammerfall with 2.6.2. driver on WindowsXPsp1

sometimes by just adding one effect to one track. Course I am still running 2.03.

I have not been successful with using either Reason or Project 5 with Ableton Live without gettting major hang ups. Reason. Project 5 or Ableton will slow down the audio, dropout, miss beats on looping ect. And the worst my computer completely shuts off period. No goodbye nothing. Only happens with Ableton live.

I recently bought a Toshiba satellite Pentium 4, 2.8 ghz with 512 Ram specifically to run Live in real "live" performances. Doesnt cut it. Now I am looking at other ways that are more stable. Ummm like a digital 8 track:) maybe cubase or sonar

Also, I have hardly anything else on this computer. Its main purpose is strictly for music.

I dont understand how there are so many others out there who swear by it using it live.

apupped wrote:sometimes by just adding one effect to one track. Course I am still running 2.03.

I have not been successful with using either Reason or Project 5 with Ableton Live without gettting major hang ups. Reason. Project 5 or Ableton will slow down the audio, dropout, miss beats on looping ect. And the worst my computer completely shuts off period. No goodbye nothing. Only happens with Ableton live.

I recently bought a Toshiba satellite Pentium 4, 2.8 ghz with 512 Ram specifically to run Live in real "live" performances. Doesnt cut it. Now I am looking at other ways that are more stable. Ummm like a digital 8 track:) maybe cubase or sonar

Also, I have hardly anything else on this computer. Its main purpose is strictly for music.

I dont understand how there are so many others out there who swear by it using it live.

I've got a similar computer--Toshiba satelite 2430, P4 desktop processor, 1 gig RAM--I gig with it almost weekly with 100% crash free success. First off, the soundcard and its drivers are a key component to many crashes--please let us know what you are using. I use an RME multiface.

Your instant shut-off happened to me as well. But mine started happening in a CAD program while doing processor intensive tasks. Then it started doing it with audio apps while rendering. Turns out the problem is...dirt! You undoubtedly have a bunch of dirt and fibers between your fans and the heatsink. This blocks the airflow over the processor, and when it reaches critical temperatures it instantly shuts off with no warning--straight to the black screen--suck for you, but at least it keeps the computer from frying. Its only happened to you with Ableton because I guess your not running any other apps that are using the processor as heavily. I took my heatsink out and removed and 1/8" thick mat of fibers--if you're comfortable doing it, do it, otherwise get a computer repair shop to do it--takes 5 minutes. After doing that, it was unbelievable how much more power i had. CAD renderings that were taking 30 minutes (if they didn't overheat/crash my computer before finishing) now only take 5-8. Basically P4 desktop chips inside laptops are pushing it heat-wise, and you need to religiously wipe off the dirt and fibers that get on your fan intake vents, thus keeping the gunk from getting inside and caught up on the heatsink. This has been my only problem on my toshiba, and it was easily remedied, and I seem to be avoiding a reoccurence by cleaning off the fan screens.

P5 rewired to ABleton hasn't been that stable for me. Ableton by itself has been incredibly stable. Ableton with FL studio rewired to it has been flawless. REason too, except for a documented problem with missing the first beat of a reason loop. I have all kind of crap on my computer--mad graphics programs, net surfing, all sorts of audio stuff, CAD programs, external drives full of audio---no problems whatsoever related to that. I've had excellent sucess with 2.0.3 and 3.0.2--I've gigged with both (I'm all bout 3.0.2 now!). I'd suggest posting you soundcard info here, and also going to http://www.musicxp.net/ and also www.blackviper.com to find tips on trimming some xp fat for running audio.

Trust me, your Toshiba can totally kick ass with Live, the problem does not lie with the machine (other than the dirt/heat) or Live. Take care or the dirt problem, and let us know what your soundcard is. The dirt could be the cause of hang-ups and glitches, but it could well be your soundcard (are you using internal or usb?? both are not desirable).

Ryan

Ryan

Thank you quandry for the suggestions....

I am using the internal soundcard that came with the computer. Which undoubtedly could play a huge part in it. I agree. I am still on the fence on which soundcard to get. I was looking at the indigo dj because it fits within my budget.

I must say I have never had a "crash" problem with my destop pc which is considerable older and slower. In fact I am thinking of using that now to play live because of stability. Also I can use the parellel out for midi in and out instead with alot less latency than using the laptop and a usb hookup.

I am not sure about the "dirt" issue because the laptop is only 3 months old and is well taken care of. Maybe?

Interesting enough, I just had the major crash again today with Ableton, Acid and Sound Forge. Sound Forge was the one that was opened up, the others minimized not playing. I was working on a file in Sound Forge and kaboooom off goes the puter!

I am now running task manager to check cpu overload while running certain apps to see if I can pinpoint. Recycle today had it up to almost 100% but it didnt crash.

The internal soundcard is like a realtek AC90 audio card. I am using a Toshiba satellite A35-S209 if that matters at all.

Thanks again, if you have any advice on a soundcard? I was thinking of using the pmcia maybe?

apupped wrote:Thank you quandry for the suggestions....

I am using the internal soundcard that came with the computer. Which undoubtedly could play a huge part in it. I agree. I am still on the fence on which soundcard to get. I was looking at the indigo dj because it fits within my budget.

I must say I have never had a "crash" problem with my destop pc which is considerable older and slower. In fact I am thinking of using that now to play live because of stability. Also I can use the parellel out for midi in and out instead with alot less latency than using the laptop and a usb hookup.

I am not sure about the "dirt" issue because the laptop is only 3 months old and is well taken care of. Maybe?

Interesting enough, I just had the major crash again today with Ableton, Acid and Sound Forge. Sound Forge was the one that was opened up, the others minimized not playing. I was working on a file in Sound Forge and kaboooom off goes the puter!

I am now running task manager to check cpu overload while running certain apps to see if I can pinpoint. Recycle today had it up to almost 100% but it didnt crash.

The internal soundcard is like a realtek AC90 audio card. I am using a Toshiba satellite A35-S209 if that matters at all.

Thanks again, if you have any advice on a soundcard? I was thinking of using the pmcia maybe?

Seriously, dirt is your problem. That is the only logical reason for an xp P4 laptop to instantly power-off--it only does that to save itself from overheating, the overheating is caused by dirt, 100% sure, without a doubt. Here's a forum were this happens to people all the time: http://forums.compuserve.com/gvforums/d ... iba&loc=us
Mine did it after 6 month from being brand new. Trust me, its dirt, get rid of the dirt and your machine will rock. The desktop doesn't crash because its a desktop--lots of loud fans to keep that processor cool. P4 desktop chips in laptop are pushing it heatwise, and all it takes is some dirt and fibers (or pet hair) and some processer heavy tasks and its overheat time. The internal soundcard is your problem without a doubt. Totally worthless for Live. YOu have a powerful laptop, that can definitely run Live extremely smoothly and fast--trust me, I perform live with mine often. Take care ot the dirt, and get a real soundcard, and you're off and running, forget the desktop. Yeah, pcmcia is great, thats what my RME multiface is. Its faster than firewire, and frees up your fw port for an external hd for your audio files.

Ryan

well, after a couple of weeks I have come to believe YOU ARe RIght! Talked to toshiba on the phone for about 4 hours and went thru all software related possibilities. its definetely hardware. One thing though is I updated my bios from there support website, rolled back to last known good configuration and it hasnt crashed again. yet. I still need to take it in and get it thoroughly checked out and get the fans cleaned. Thanks for your help

told ya! that damn dirty dirt. seriously, it takes 5 minutes to remove your heatsink, clean it off, and reinstall it (unplug and remove battery first)--then its party time. Go for it, or get a friend or shop to do it for ya. I too installed the latest BIOS blah blah blah, but the real problem was dirt.

Ryan

Thanks Ryan! well........ I also didnt realize duh, the fans are at the bottom and welll it doesnt help when i lay the dang laptop on the couch or my lap. I have now been told they are no longer laptops but portables! Wish they wouldnt of put the fans on the bottom!

word, but where else could one put the fans??? From an audio perspective, they are certainly the quietest on the bottom. From a design standpoint, they can't really be anywhere else, the sides are all about connectivity, ports, speakers, and drives. The top is keyboard and track pad. That leaves the bottom.

There are laptop sized fan bases that are plastic, about 3/4" thick, and have up to four fans inside. You can power these fans via the usb connector. They cost like $15 bucks. I got one when experiencing my dirt problems, and though I never use the fans anymore, I like having my laptop raised up a bit more of the desk, and it seems to cut down on the amount of dirt getting on the fan intakes. If using a laptop on the couch or lap, these are great, as are big ol books that you laptop can rest on. Fibers from couches and clothes are what clog up on the heatsink in the first place, so avoiding sucking fibers into the fans is a good idea.

Ryan

Since some weeks, live suddenly crashes "unerwartet beendet"..... I don´t know wat this could be. the cpu-usage is somwhere 25%.

i use a M-Audio FW 410 for audio, and a Midisport 2x2 for Midi
ibook g4 800´ 640 MB Ram, OSX 10.3.2, Ableton live 3.0.2

I send a huge log-file to Ableton a while ago. They are investigating this issue. I don't believe it is hardware related.