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PlayStation 3 as external DSP Card for Live & Plugins !

Posted: Thu Nov 01, 2007 2:58 pm
by zebebop
All is in the Subject ! It's just an idea...
Hey Ableton why don't you implement support for external DSP based on the Sony PS3 Cell Processor directly in Live 7...8... ?!

Solution for using PS3 Cell processor in distributed computing already exist :
http://folding.stanford.edu/English/Main
http://www.netlib.org/utk/people/JackDo ... /scop3.pdf

Today internal/external DSP Card from TC electronic (PowerCore), Universal Audio (UAD-1)... are expensive (600$ ~ +3000$) and limited with proprietary plugins !

Imagine all Live Instruments and FX, VST, VSTi & AU plugins boosted with the Cell Processor as a big DSP for... 399 $ (price of the 40Go PS3 version) ! Ableton could be the first (before steinberg, cakewalk...) for using external ressource like an "Open" DSP unit.

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TC electronic PowerCore X8
- Cost ~ 1499 €
- 8 DSP @ 150 Mhz (?!)
- Firewire (400 Mbit/s)

Sony PS3
- Cost ~ 399 €
- 8 SPE (DSP like) inside the Cell @ 3.2 Ghz (~200 Gigaflops !)
- Gigabit Ethernet (1000 Mbit/s)

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Short Overview 

The Cell architecture consists of a number of elements:

The Cell Processor
This is a 9 core processor, one of these cores is a PowerPC and acts as a controller.  The remaining 8 cores are called SPEs and these are very high performance vector processors.  Each SPE contains it's own block of high speed RAM and is capable of 32 GigaFlops (32 bit).  The SPEs are independent processors and can act alone or can be set up to process a stream of data with different SPEs working on different stages.  This ability to act as a "stream processor" gives access to the full processing power of a Cell which is claimed to be more than 10 times higher than even the fastest desktop processors.

In addition to the raw processing power the Cell includes a high performance multi-channel memory subsystem and a number of high speed interconnects for connecting to other Cells or I/O devices.

Distributing Processing
A software infrastructure under development will allow Cells to work together.  While they can be directly connected via the high speed interconnects they can also be connected in other ways or distributed over a network.  The Cells are not gaming or computer specific, they can be in anything from PDAs to TVs but they can still be used to act as a single system.

Parallel programming is usually complex but in this case the OS will look at the resources it has and distribute tasks accordingly, this process does not involve any more programming than the initial parallelisation.  If you want more processing power you simply add more Cells, you do not need to replace the existing ones as the new Cells will augment the existing ones.

Overall the Cell architecture is an architecture for distributed, parallel processing using very powerful computational engines developed using a highly aggressive design strategy.  These devices shall be produced in vast numbers so they will provide vast processing resources at a low cost.

Posted: Thu Nov 01, 2007 6:32 pm
by abletoff
just got one, the sixaxis would rock too

Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2007 10:32 pm
by zebebop
Come one guys... any comment are welcome !

Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 12:43 pm
by siliconarc
+1 for being able to watch youtube lolvids and play games whilst 'performing' live

Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 1:29 pm
by zebebop
garyboozy wrote:+1 for being able to watch youtube lolvids and play games whilst 'performing' live
lol :D
But seriously !

New links:
http://fr.440forums.com/forums/?s=8a7ce ... ntry217799
http://www.playstation.com/ps3-openplatform/index.html[/url]
http://www.powerdeveloper.org/platforms ... laystation
http://www.bsc.es/projects/deepcomputing/linuxoncell/

It's seems that i am not alone to think the Cell PS3 Processor has a great potential...

Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:11 pm
by j24keys
Sounds good, but its DSP power better be able to exceed dedicated DSPs in its price range. If so, then yeah man!! :arrow: However, the Cell processor requires very complex coding, which could present VERY intensive debugging and code-length optimization.

Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:58 pm
by zebebop
j24keys wrote:Sounds good, but its DSP power better be able to exceed dedicated DSPs in its price range. If so, then yeah man!! :arrow: However, the Cell processor requires very complex coding, which could present VERY intensive debugging and code-length optimization.
In fact it's true, everyone say that coding is more complex on ps3. but coding a driver or API on windows/Mac and a microcode on PS3 to implement a cpu routing process would be more easier (i guess) than a full game ;) This could be a open project (not only from Ableton) on SourceForge !?

Second, even if the Cell is used at ~90% of its capabilities (10% for OS and GUI) and not at 100% like most dedicated DSP Box, the challenge is always very interesting IMHO !

Be shure i'm ready for beta testing :D