struggling with music lessons

theque · Post by **theque** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 1:57 am

hey peoples, i am sure i am not the only one here. I have been having piano lessons for about six months (very traditional ones, based entirely on reading and playing increasingly difficult music).

So i am improving very slowly but i find it a little boring and tedious. And i am still really crap at reading music.

My question to you all is can you offer me any alternatives to traditional music lessons? I would either like to find a new teacher who uses a different approach , or maybe some kind of learn yourself system i can incorporate along with my current lessons.

i have tried searching for a new teacher but don't know how to find one who teaches differently, and all the "teach yourself dvd's " and "online courses" seem a bit info-mercial esque, promising you will be brilliant in three weeks or your money back type of thing.

So i anyone can offer any advice or an alternative i have not thought of or share any experiences i will be most grafeful.

thanks........

LiveUserX · Post by **LiveUserX** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:31 am

Don't underestimate the opportunities and choices you'll gain by learning to formally play and read music. It is the only thing that truly sustains. Musical fads & styles come and go but true musicianship will sustain you. If lessons are getting you down and you have no other quality alternatves for teachers, you will have to SUPPLEMENT your musical education with research and independent study.

I recommend your favorite records and then local musicians that are out playing with others and performing as a starting point. You will learn in these settings what music lessons alone will never teach you. Additionally, while learning from your teacher, YOU teach yourself about what YOU love. Surf the internet and read books. They are rich with content for learning to play, record, compose and read music at the highest levels.

The whole of music is NOT entirely wrapped up in what your teacher is teaching. He/she is only providing one of many important elements. Right now your teacher's element may not be much fun but trust me, years down the line when you have to forego good paying/playing opportunities because you don't truly know your shit is a LOT LESS fun.

Truly making it in music is not about doing what you love and having fun all the time. Truly making it is about having choices, doing what you love and having fun MOST of the time. There are no shortcuts. Good luck!

theque · Post by **theque** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:55 am

thankd live userxxx,

thanks for the reply, well said and i agree with all your comments, i do think however that there are different ways of teaching that suit diferent people. for example there id the suzuki method for teaching music which is very different from traditional lessons but is still very effective. i am dysclxic so when i was young i had many learning problems like reading,the normal system of teaching did not work for me, but when i was taught in an alternate manner i picked it up easily.

so i am not really looking for a shortcut but rather an alternate method of learning.

cheers for the meaage

SolonOfAthens · Post by **SolonOfAthens** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:55 am

A method that you could learn that is used on most modern "pop" songs is to do chords with your left hand and the melody with your right hand. My mom enjoyed the following book that discusses this method:
Play Piano in a Flash
http://www.amazon.com/Piano-Flash-Favor ... im_b_img_1
I'm sure there are other books that teach this method too.
Good Luck

nowtime · Post by **nowtime** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:08 am

SolonOfAthens wrote:A method that you could learn that is used on most modern "pop" songs is to do chords with your left hand and the melody with your right hand. My mom enjoyed the following book that discusses this method:
Play Piano in a Flash
http://www.amazon.com/Piano-Flash-Favor ... im_b_img_1
I'm sure there are other books that teach this method too.
Good Luck

you're onto something important there...

I would add this:

Do you sing?

Learning the keyboard is a great way to learn the math/laws of harmony. But it is very heady work (playing lots of scales/technique is good for moving your fingers and getting more physical) but the ultimate is to sing and get the body involved.

This way, when you're at the keyboard it's more of a physical thing and not just heady math. The other benefit to incorporating singing is this: music is a holy trinity. You got BASS on the bottom, you got HARMONIC MOVEMENT in the middle, and you've got MELODY on top. It is difficult to play melodically on the piano (it is easier using strings/organs/synths). Most piano lessons focus on the middle - harmony. Maybe learn a little boogie-woogie blues or some classical that incorporates bass lines.

Another alternative/shortcut is making an open tuning guitar using only roots and fifths, and play and sing pop/beatles/marley songs from books; you dont have to worry about chord types on most songs. you just play the open chords with the harmonic rhythym of the songs. you learn alot about harmony that way.

mohler · Post by **mohler** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:23 am

I have a question:

What are you trying to achieve from your lessons?

e.g.
to become a pianist/performer?
Or to enhance your writing/production skills?
something else?

Just thought I'd ask!

Just thought I'd ask because I started lessons about 6 months ago as well (every 2 weeks). I have a friend who I've been doing some work with, he used to be a composer/arranger in Hollywood he loves my ear and where I'm coming from musically and I don't follow the rules (cause I don't know them), anyway I asked him what could I do to improve my production skills and he said find someone to teach me chord theory and then to learn Jazz piano.

So it's similar to some of the suggestions above.

I managed to find a teacher and explained exactly what I was looking for. He's a Concert pianist and teaches a very traditional method in schools to kids but he adapted really well and we have did a combo of Chord theory, Aural traiing and basic harmony some reading and writing skills. (try writing on the stave to improve your reading it really helped me).

We moved on to 4/5 part harmony for strings/voice 2 months ago and I've been left on my own since he has been traveling, but I'm happy because I'm able to apply all of that in the studio to my writing & production. I haven't become a wonderful pianist but that wasn't what I was aiming for.

I'd say try to explain to your teacher what you are trying to achieve and if they can help great, if not try and find someone who can.

for me finding a drum instructor is the next challenge

Mr_You · Post by **Mr_You** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:05 am

*deleted*

v00d00ppl · Post by **v00d00ppl** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:10 am

my only advice is to tough it out because you will only get better if you endure a struggle.

at first i used to just loop up my drums or buy drum kits from different libraries, but once i struggled and gained experience with chopping/truncating.....i pretty much stick to making my own drums.

just an analogy.

meantown · Post by **meantown** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:11 am

Certainly realize that Live is an excellent tool for learning. Take your favorite song and loop section to section or small as you need. Learn to use your ear. Google for chords of popular songs. Songbooks with chords, etc. Tune song to your piano.

If you play guitar translate back and forth with songs you know on guitar to keyboard can teach you things and inspire ideas for new songs.

Obviously not the only way but certainly useful.

Rattmouth · Post by **Rattmouth** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:41 am

The free Ravenspiral Guide (pdf) has been super helpful for me.

http://www.ravenspiral.com/ravenspiralguide.pdf

--Matt

theque · Post by **theque** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 8:21 am

thanks for all the respones,

mohler is suggesting what i am getting at, i don't wish to be a concert pianist by any means, i would like to learn more for the production side of things (and just because i would like to be able to play for myself aswell).

I would like to learn more about chord structure and .... well all the stuff mohler said actually. Thanks for the help i think i will start looking for a new teacher. i guess i needed to find out if there are such teachers or different paths to follow.

but if anyone else has any other thoughts please let me know.

snowtires · Post by **snowtires** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 9:35 am

i started playing piano when i was 6, by playing very basic melodies for folk songs, etc. eventually, i graduated to playing stuff out of the 'easy' billy joel books and stuff like that. sometimes classical music isn't the easiest thing to pick up, especially if you are just learning. it took me until i was almost in college to start feeling comfortable playing classical music, and even then i didn't really enjoy it. ask your teacher to try and tailor your lessons towards a more popular style of music, or just get a teacher who teaches something that you're going to enjoy playing. if you enjoy playing it, then you're going to want to learn it more and you'll pick it up a whole lot faster.

90's child · Post by **90's child** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 9:46 am

Just type the "circles of fifths" into google. This was the single most important music lesson in taking my understanding of music to the next level.

udp · Post by **udp** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:11 pm

There is no shortcut to learning the craft of composition. Your instinct of getting some piano training wad correct. It will not come overnight or in 6 months for that matter. You DO need to assess the goal for your taking the lessons. This will help your teacher, whether the current or a new one, guide you. What you need to realize is that this will take decades, not months or years. IF you are serious about it, then 4 hours a day writing and practicing the piano will be an off day. 8-10 hours will start to get it done. IF you're not serious and it's just for funsies, then an hour a day should help you improve. The scales and arpeggios, the etudes, and exercises all go to teaching you the craft of composition. Not only will you read music, but you'll know when and how to employ thousands of combinations of notes, and rhythms. You'll understand HOW to get what is inside your head, out. After you've mastered the how, then and only then, you can begin to focus on the art. Crafting serious music isn't for the little boy sitting in his basement with Garage Band. Take your time and enjoy learning your art, but realize it isn't all fun and games IF your serious. It just like getting in shape, you must spend time working out and exercising to do it and it doesn't happen overnight. Good luck.

threestringclarinet · Post by **threestringclarinet** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:30 pm

Theque,
Just to chime in with my experience. I am a guitar player, but I think that the same rules apply. I studied Jazz composition at the University and I had many teachers along the way. To be honest, most of them were crap. But some of them were amazing. You need to find someone who is excited about teaching and can convey the information in a way that you understand. I am now a teacher myself and find that we all learn in different ways....that's why our public school systems suck...they are not tailored to the needs/learning styles of our kids. I know I'm not saying anything really new here, just re-enforcing what the others have said. Find a great teacher! If your city has a lot of teachers, try a few of them out. Get recommendations. Call the music department at the local college and ask them for suggestions. Good luck.