Ableton Forum

Preferably sample based. anyone have any recommendations? For disco/funk/house...

Strings too for that matter

Don't know if this is what you are looking for but hit this thread

http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=81561

As a trumpeter and composer/producer, I gotta say I haven't heard anything that's really satisfying. I've heard a few and ended up purchasing the best IMO which is Garritan Big Band, but it's turned out to be a lot more trouble than it's worth in terms of the cost, the learning curve and the crashes (with Logic at least). The sounds are quality, but for the life of me, no matter how much controller data I put on the horns, they always sound artificial. This song is the best I've done with Garritan (don't ask how many cumulative hours I lost from crashes working on this):

http://www.exaltron.com/mp3s/damages4.mp3

You can hear the Garritan tbs and saxes after the first chorus, then again when the main theme comes back in (roughly halfway through). I think you'll find that the bari saxes are the most convincing, and that the saxes and tbs are pretty natural sounding when they're under the live trumpet.

So I would say if you want horns, get some decent samples, but preferably ones that work in the sampler of your choice (ie, you shouldn't have to learn Kontakt as you do with Garritan- it's not worth the hassle). Then make nice with a horn player who can give you some tasty human-sounding top end to counter the bland texture of sampled horns.

The good news is that in Live you can pitch horns down and they still sound really rich (if not totally authentic). You still get the subtle changes in timbre and the human attack, just slowed down a bit. If I have time tonight I'll put up some examples of pitched-down tpt, it sounds remarkably like a trombone.

You're better off getting Melodyne and using that with recorded phrases from the ueberschall liquid instruments collection or other sources. Can't really play it like an instrument but it will sound more real than using samplers.

thanks for the ideas guys. going to check out garritan for now. Good idea to use melodyne to reshape a sample or loop. Might give that a go too.

Honestly, check out the Synful demo. Record some phrases by itself by midi, and then play it back with the box checked that says '1 second delay for realsim' or whatever. It's all about the expression and the way it sounds between notes. It looks ahead and makes realistic note changes like a player would. Sounds great, takes up no room.

Yes, a good sample set sounds better, but it's less expressive. I find a mix of synful and kontakt's included VSL instruments is great as the sampled sounds can really add to it when you want a big sound, but synful's great for both solo instruments and ensembles. Between the two, there's nothing more I could want for orchestra sounds.

i've never had luck with synthesized or sampled horns. so, like a true coward, i've tried to avoid them for the rest of life

I've never used it myself, but I remember Arturia Brass getting a few decent reviews when it was released; though granted that doesn't necessarily mean it is convincingly real; or for that matter stable or practical to use.

Anyone given it a go?

http://www.arturia.com/evolution/en/pro ... intro.html

Lo-Key Fu wrote:I've never used it myself, but I remember Arturia Brass getting a few decent reviews when it was released; though granted that doesn't necessarily mean it is convincingly real; or for that matter stable or practical to use.

Anyone given it a go?

http://www.arturia.com/evolution/en/pro ... intro.html

Just listening to the demos, I am not impressed. Contrasting Arturia with Garritan, it sounds abjectly fake and tinny, while Garritan just sounds a bit lifeless in certain applications. If you listen to some of the Garritan demos, I think you'll find a few examples where they've achieved a sound almost indistinguishable from real horns. I would even assert that my own Garritan stuff that I posted above sounds more natural and authentic than the Arturia demos (which presumably were produced by pros with much more experience composing and programming horns).

Wait a couple more years until they can achieve a convincing sample system or modeler for horns. If they can do it for piano, they can do it for horns (granted, horns do represent a different challenge with pitch and attack issues).

In the meantime, find some young jazz horn players (typically conservatory students will be able to play the shit out of anything you put in front of them on the funk/disco tip). I've found that a lot of them are psyched to do something creative outside their normal sphere of music and will do it for free or in exchange for some favor you could offer them. I bet a lot of horn players would love to get a free primer on Live in exchange for laying down a few licks.

Best ones i've heard:

http://www.wallanderinstruments.com/

Pricey, though.

Geezus wrote:You're better off getting Melodyne and using that with recorded phrases from the ueberschall liquid instruments collection or other sources. Can't really play it like an instrument but it will sound more real than using samplers.

I do the same thing with pitch envelopes and complex mode in Live. I agree, that playing horns on a keyboard sucks dog-nuts.

Does melodyne offer that much more quality in pitch-shifting than the pitch envelopes in Live on complex mode? How much is it? Worth the money?

I really dig this for trumpet sounds

http://www.soundfonts.it/?a=read&b=25

check the demo...

m:o wrote:I really dig this for trumpet sounds

http://www.soundfonts.it/?a=read&b=25

check the demo...

SMonk wrote:Best ones i've heard:

http://www.wallanderinstruments.com/

Pricey, though.