Ableton Forum

Mine is:-

Voxengo Marquis - tightening up the bottom end
BBE Sonic Maximiser - sprinkling the fairy dust
PSP Vintage Warmer - Limiting and adding tape saturation

Is that an OK mastering chain?

What about EQ?

Varies a lot but at home, I tend to go psp mastercomp or voxengo soniformer for a touch of light mastering compression, EQ (choose from one of many I own, depending on the sound I want), steinberg magneto (optional - tape saturation, depending on the track), and voxengo elephant 2.7 limiter (the best limiter / price ratio around imho). At work we have UAD-1 which has some nice tools such as precision limiter and Neve EQs etc. We also have Waves but I am not a fan of most of their plugins, maxxbass excepted.

I do my mix finalizing/mastering in Soundforge typically so can't use Live devices like EQ8, fortunately I have Sonalksis and PSP Neon among others.

I always check the mix first with the soundforge tools analysis and using voxengo SPAN and phase meters and goniometers for spectral/phase/stereo image analysis before committing the master mix.

I check the master mix in Harbal to see if there are any frequency holes or too much spiking/troughs in certain frequency ranges and tidy that up a bit manually (never use the automated parameters, often is too harsh). After that I might need to take it back into Soundforge and adjust the levels again. Then when everything is completed, make a new master mix for mp3 (for low bitrate put limiter to -1.1 db instead of -0.3 for CD, high pass 40 Hz, take out some 12 Khz and above and add a little 5-8, for high bitrate, just high pass 30 Hz and leave the rest alone except the limiter at -1.1db to allow for encoding errors (encoders often add in conversion spikes of +0.6 to +1.0 db which causes clipping if you don't adjust).

Then finally I use CD Architect 5.2 to arrange tracks / edit / burn any CDs I want to red book standards.

i usually keep it simple: EQ-8 > Compressor II > Saturator

though on my last one i didnt use any plugins on the master at all... it's still kind of a rough draft though. might end up applying the usual a little later.

Great response Leedsquiet man.

I'm only using my mastering chain to get my tracks up in volume and punch in order to get a better A/B comparison against commercial releases. I find that if I don't pump up the volume of my track by using plugs on the mastering channel then its impossible to compare levels.

I often wonder how many db's are added at the mastering stage? I guessed at 6 db so I have been trying to import a WAV file from Beatport,, then lowering the volume of that commercial WAV by -6db and using that to write/mix against with no mastering plugs but it didn't work to well.

Having a mastering chain does give me a better idea when comparing the levels of say my kick and snare against a commercial release but I'm not sure if that's the way to go.

What d'you reckon?

I know I'm in the minority, but I really don't like Vintage Warmer at all. I use Kjaerhus Golden EQ then PSP Nitro (which has a nice stereo widener) and then Elephant, in that order. I often use Live's Spectral Analysis plugin as well to help me visually see any trouble spots.

I rarely use an external editor for mastering my productions any more.

Nothing. I leave it to someone who knows what they are doing

^^ actually that's the best answer

however, when i've just finished up a track and want to test it out at a gig or send it over to friends to play it out, i will give it that quick little self mastering treatment.

nebulae wrote:I know I'm in the minority, but I really don't like Vintage Warmer at all.

i dont like it either

nebulae wrote:I know I'm in the minority, but I really don't like Vintage Warmer at all. I use Kjaerhus Golden EQ then PSP Nitro (which has a nice stereo widener) and then Elephant, in that order. I often use Live's Spectral Analysis plugin as well to help me visually see any trouble spots.

I rarely use an external editor for mastering my productions any more.

why are you using a filter on the master channel?

Oh right for the stereo widening.

jeskola wrote:Nothing. I leave it to someone who knows what they are doing

I agree I think as an artist we are to "psychologically" involved with the music to be able to detach and make the best mastering choices. That does not mean that we don't have the academic aptitude to apply devices (compression, stereo widening, etc....) While expensive and tempting to do my own, for important final results I prefer to use a mastering engineer......

^ Yeah, Nitro, IMO, is a hugely underrated plugin. Not only does it have 4 filters, but each filter can operate (a la FM style) on each other...and each "filter" slot also has other very high quality effects, one of which is a Stereo Widener, perfect for mastering if used in very slight amounts.

I usually go:

Cambridge EQ (UAD) for hi and lowpass (20Hz and 20kHz)

Precision Buss Compressor (UAD) for glueing things together

Vintage Warmer for warmth / saturation

Sometimes Pultec EQ (UAD) for boosting and more "shine".

Sometimes GVST´s GStereo for widening (very nice tool and free, have a look at it here: http://www.gvst.co.uk/beta.htm )

Precision Limiter (UAD)

^ those GVSTs are fabulous.

I agree totally with you Jeskola.

However, while not claiming to be a ME, I have done a couple of courses and read various books over the years, such as Bob Katz's Mastering Audio 2nd edition etc, and have been recording and engineering multitrack and now computer DAW for 20 odd years.

So as my recordings are not big budget commercial jobs, I tend to do the work myself. Always better to have a real pro with their external objectivity (and sometimes superior equipment such as Massenburg EQs and Weiss compressors etc) if you can afford it though.

Yes, I think you do need a mix that is 'closer' to the finished article than the DAW mix, reps and A&R people are used to referencing against finished, mastered product, so I think some judicious use of EQ/compression/limiting/stereo tools/saturators or whatever is fine, but don't overdo it !!

It's better to not have to pump a mix 5db or more, but in practice this often happens and with the loudness wars it is not uncommon for tracks to be pumped +9 or +10 in mastering, but most MEs would not recommend or enjoy working on that kind of material.

Dance floor orientated house/techno etc is often mastered to an average RMS of -8 to -9 rms (sometimes as high as -4, who needs dynamics when we can give you headache inducing volume fatigue !), I tend to go a bit less and average out loud pumping tracks to about -11 db (it actually sounds better on the radio than the super loud -7 or higher mixes), and for my alternative rock productions or old skool electro (a la JMJ, Vangelis etc) leave a bit more dynamic range, typically around -12 to -13 db average RMS. If you were doing classical or jazz recordings you might want to leave even more dynamics/less average RMS and go for an average around -17 db for those dramatic sweeps and swings.

What would you rather have - nice music that makes you want to turn up the music or ear fatigue inducing hypercompressed loud material that makes you want to turn it down (or off).

Having said this, if your mix is more than 3 dbs or so off the typical reference, you might have to pump it more and lose dynamics just for the sake of it, if you are thinking of going commercial.

I like Vintage Warmer on guitar tracks, it can really add punch to those, but prefer Mastercomp and Elephant in my mastering chain.

I can relate a lot to leedsquietman. Except for most of the better plugs he uses I tend to adopt the same basic concepts about mastering. However, I tend to have a more radical view when it comes to who should do the mastering

No disrespect to the learned ME's and especially those who have access to the expensive top-of-the-line equipment, but I beleive the artist started out seeing/hearing the work and he alone is able to see deep inside of him what he is trying to express. I mean some creativity could be lost if at such a critical stage.

In fine art, does the artist give out his paintings to be mastered? I know to some this might seem a little naive or absurd, but think about it. An artsite probably does not deserve being called an artiste till he is able to create and master his works in order to fully express what he was actually feeling/seeing originally.

However, on the other hand I know that certain prestine sonic qualities can only be acheived with the correct equipment and that engineers have to be trained to use these, so in order for the artiste to acheive this he may need assistance. IMO however, he should still have control over the product's direction.