I give up...

SongCarver · Post by **SongCarver** » Fri Jan 03, 2003 12:27 am

DT, I have no other host, in OS X anyway. I have Cubase VST 4.1 in 9, if that is what you work in (OS 9)

-Keith (songCarver)

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sat Jan 04, 2003 3:03 am

Hi there again SC.

For this I am using a PC rig and also stopped using Cubase some while back. I don't know how Cubase deals with live routing of signals but if you have Reaktor for Mac you are welcome to take a look.

I seem to remember there being a problem controlling inserts from an external controller in Cubase and this along with a number of sends is where I run Reaktor along with the looping ensembles.

I handle triggering if quantised "clips" in Logic by using a feature it has called Touch Tracks, this also works with VSTI's. They are basically MIDI loops that can be made to trigger from a Note On, sampler, VSTi, etc and can quantise to bars/beats etc. Tap tempo also was something Cubase didn't do from an external controller when I was using it but that may have changed by now.

If there are demos of both Logic and Reaktor available for your OS I'd recommend looking into this if you have any urgency. We seem to be on a similar wavelength here. I've actually gone full circle with this and ended up using the pice of software I was originally using and found out there was more in it than I thought, mainly the Touch Tracks deal which I didn't realise could quantise. These can be recorded into and overdubbed but are MIDI of course.

DT

Bernd · Post by **Bernd** » Sun Jan 05, 2003 8:01 am

Hi to all.

First I have to say thanks for your kind and respectfull way to point as to the fact, that we missed to solve a big problem for you and others and that we really disappointed you.

To the whole recording issue I will not say much, just that I will talk to Gerhard and the others to see what we will do in future versions. But this was not your point that frustrated you so much.

Before I go into detail I have to say that also I - like Alex - am not the one who did the VST implementation, but because I am responsible for the whole software development I can probably say some words, but please excuse if I am not totally correct about what I am saying about the VST implementation. But you can be sure that on Monday I will discuss all this with Hans, who did the VST implementation.

Well, the basic idea of the VST implementation of Live 1.0 - 2.0 was supporting just the VST standand version 1, not version 2 with all the VSTi stuff and all the other useful things in version 2.

Obiously we have implementated some very few things of version 2 but also obiously not carefully the syncing capabilities to the end.

I personally realized about the size of the VST syncing problem - how many are waiting for this and how important it is for you - just some few days before we released Live 2. Now you probably say: hey, c'mon, we are crying for it since a year. But I can just say that your cry for help reach me just some days ago, please believe me. And I have to say sorry for that and this is definitively our fault because you probably posted it more than once in the forum.

Ok, but what happens then. We decided to not start implementing it because it had to much risk to distroy something else and for my point of view it wasn't a bug but a missing feature.

But of course now I understand for you as the user of this implementation it feels like a bug.

So for now I just please you to wait two more days and I will do my best to give you good news on tuesday. See you then, have a nice day, best regards, Bernd.

Mbazzy · Post by **Mbazzy** » Sun Jan 05, 2003 9:47 am

I'm always in awe of the openmindness of the A-team ... Respect!

Gerhard · Post by **Gerhard** » Tue Jan 07, 2003 8:41 pm

Hi DT, SoundCarver, and all,

1.) I am very sorry to hear about your frustrations.

2.) Thank you very much for your detailed explanations.

3.) We are currently looking into the Reaktor sync problem and I expect it to be solved in the next release.

4.) Yes, it would be wonderful to incorporate functionality as offered by the Echoplex into Live without you having to resort to plugs or other sophisticated external solutions. This is a heavy task, however. An appently simple thing like non-exclusive clips in one track has huge implications on the whole thing: the arranger display, the audio engine, the disk reading scheme, etc.. I cannot tell you when this will be done, and in what way it *can* be done.

But we should at least be able to fix that damn sync bug now.

Gerhard / ableton

SongCarver · Post by **SongCarver** » Wed Jan 08, 2003 4:02 am

Hello Gerhard,

hmm its actually SONGcarver, but anyway :-)

If you may, please reconsider my newer, RESAMPLE idea, as it does not require non-exclusive clips, and I think would have minimal impact on the track view, as a result.

www.homepage.mac.com/songcarver/resample.jpg

Much more importantly though,

I seem to be getting a fair number of bugs/ crashes in 10.1 which I have documented and emailed prior. Would you say having 10.2 would fix most of these?

Thank you,

-Keith

jdg · Post by **jdg** » Wed Jan 08, 2003 7:08 am

how two or more laptops running in midi sync.///?

Gerhard · Post by **Gerhard** » Wed Jan 08, 2003 9:52 am

Keith, sorry about the wrong name..

SongCarver wrote:Hello Gerhard,
I seem to be getting a fair number of bugs/ crashes in 10.1 which I have documented and emailed prior. Would you say having 10.2 would fix most of these?
-Keith

We (Alex, to be precise) are gathering all post-beta bug reports and have started fixing (first, we had to do some partying). Alex has your report. There will be a small update with bug fixes and minor improvements, but we don't know yet when.

As for your routing idea, I will check it, and get back. We are still a bit swamped, you know..

Gerhard / ableton

metrognome32 · Post by **metrognome32** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 10:09 pm

Alex/Ableton,

Haven't seen any activity on this post and was curious if you all have plans to resolve. Do you need reaktor users to help you test? Any comments?

gNome

Post by **Alex** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 10:21 pm

Hi,

Yep, not really easy to keep an overview about this thread -:).
Currently we're working on the VST sync problem with reaktor. I hope we can fix it but I cannot not guarantee when it will be fixed.

Thanks for your offer to help but because this bug is easy to reproduce for us we can test our progress here.

regards,
Alex

andreas · Post by **andreas** » Sat Jan 18, 2003 1:08 pm

yuu nice to hear this!

i am using reaktor synced in live since a while though with
a quick hack vst plug i developed a wihle ago...
(its using ppqPos which is working fine...)

http://www.smartelectronix.com/~andreas

but of course it would be much nicer without that...
also, what would be very useful:
the possibility to send midi notes to vst plugs...
on a separate midi channel, to not conflict with
live clip-triggering ...

(i dont mean sequencing, just routing notes from midi ports to the
plugs...)

cheers, grüsse
°/andreas

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sat Jan 18, 2003 1:27 pm

Anonymous wrote:Big props indeed to Andreas for his workaround. There are a few things though...

1) It cannot be used with a stereo ensemble that is dealing with stereo audio, which the ensembles I have been building and trying for a year to get working do.

2) This "fix" does nothing for Mac users.

and more to the point...

3) The mechanics for this to work properly are already there in Live. It in ..
Full props as you say to Andreas but he shouldn't even have to be doing this. Either that or Ableton should pay the guy so they can show him how to get the bloody thing working properly!!

DT

oh just realised u guys discussed this already...
thanks for the props!
doing a mac version would only require to compile it on mac..
(assuming the mac version has the same half timeinfo implemented..)

but anyway... hopefully not required to be done ..

to get a clear picture of whats going on with vsttimeinfo in live u can
use tobybears great kondor plugin (a 'hostinfo' monitor)(pc only..)

cheers
°/andreas

raapie · Post by **raapie** » Sun Feb 02, 2003 10:11 pm

are you using on your Live? looks funny, I don't see this skin included with Live.

I give up...

what skin