check out the schwarzonator

[DaddyHam]

It always comes back to the fact that Ableton is a still a company, and like any other company they have a target market. You can't hate them for that, if they don't sell, we don't get the product. I've actually watched the video several times now and I'm beginning to think its actually kind of an important video. He knew max for live was coming out so he started designing a patch instead of learning music theory (which he obviously had to know or he wouldn't have been able to make the patch). He calls himself a musician (which I am not debating) but mentions that his group had no formal musical knowledge. He mentions the fact that he was intimidated by accomplished musicians but has found a way to overcome that based on his technical abilities. He bought several instruments and didn't know how to use them at first... I'm going to go ahead and admit when I first started out, this video would have been very appealing to me. I assume it appeals to a great deal of others. By no means will this change anything, but it is a very subtle business move by Ableton and the artist. It very well could be a very insignificant move, but think of all the people it appeals to, and the exposure the artist gets. Very much a "to each it's own" situation, but it still hasn't convinced me on max4live, albeit it is one impressive program.

[darbyjones]

I might have to by M4L just for this. I think it's great, just wished he used the actual cord names instead of track names.

[alex.the.forge]

hehe, okay - bitter much, guys?
:

+1

!!

it's clever stuff, no need to dump on it.

we're farkin lucky to be musicians in these times so naysayers should maybe find some old geezers with analog studios and old computers to work with for a while and be reminded what we used to have to deal with.

I wouldn't go back for anything.

STFU!

[UKRuss]

well, and on an ordinary keyboard, you still have to know how to press each of those coords, as the layout is not regular structured. and then you have to learn to be 100% sure not never hit a wrong key.

instead, you could remove them, and make a linear button row that each is the needed coord.

why do manually work all the time to get the stuff going the way you want it, if you could sit down once, clean it up, and from then on not be able to do errors anymore?

that's what we have pc's for: to make our life more easy, and then, maybe progress.

i'm sure you won't agree on that, and thanks for the explanation. but, simple said: to each it's own.

and M4L is great, as it allows "to each it's own". nothing for you, maybe, but that doesn't matter.

I have a mac.

you think it's great, I disagree.

Incorrect. It does matter, to me.

What you mean is it doesn't matter to you that it matters to me, which is fair enough but then why post?

If I am feeling lazy I can put together a rack with scale, chord and random plugs which really does this for me.

tbh, there will be enough guys out there who will see it has the holy grail to making cool music and Abes will make their cash so that's cool, it's a commercial enterprise. Vids like these help in that aim, no-one can knock 'em for that.

But fair enough, this is a M4L reacharound thread so i should just fuck off.

[davepermen]

with pc's i mean computers in general, no win/mac shit. who cares? both are about making our life more easy. you think the mac does better, i think a winpc does better for me. that's why me made our choices.

and yes, m4l is great. and yes, i agree about building up a rack for this should be doable. but this is just an example how one can use m4l. it's like saying "i don't like that programming language, as this program, made with it, sucks". the language is independent on the uses. m4l allows tons of things, so it's great (but it's quite hard, so it could be better).

you shouldn't fuck off, no. just allow others to think different, and like different things.

[alex.the.forge]

the criticism reminds me of the comments here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-4J5j74VPw

Like Andre Rieu is cheapening Ravel by somehow making it more accessible

to me it still has the power about it

in fact it amazes me that composers could do such amazing music without a deeper knowledge of sound engineering and the frequency spectrum, yet they managed to create music with so many instruments playing at once that covered such a broad spectrum in such an aesthetically striking way

kay I'm little drunk, but I stand by my nerdy comments!!

[stringtapper]

it's like saying "i don't like that programming language, as this program, made with it, sucks". the language is independent on the uses.

This is something that UKRuss and many others just don't seem to get about M4L. If you haven't seen anything made that you would use (yet), and if you don't want to learn to make things that you would use, then those might be good reasons why it's not worth it to you, but at least be aware that in reality the only "worthless" thing about M4L itself that you're finding is that you don't want to actually use it (i.e. program). You're basing your opinion solely on what others have programmed (after a grand total of less than four weeks since its release). Max for Live devices are not Max for Live itself.

[4.33]

hey, thanks for that - i've just written a song
with the harmony coming from this little thingumabob

[davepermen]

it's like saying "i don't like that programming language, as this program, made with it, sucks". the language is independent on the uses.

This is something that UKRuss and many others just don't seem to get about M4L. If you haven't seen anything made that you would use (yet), and if you don't want to learn to make things that you would use, then those might be good reasons why it's not worth it to you, but at least be aware that in reality the only "worthless" thing about M4L itself that you're finding is that you don't want to actually use it (i.e. program). You're basing your opinion solely on what others have programmed (after a grand total of less than four weeks since its release). Max for Live devices are not Max for Live itself.

indeed. in 3 weeks, i will have 10 days off, and i will learn max4live then. what will i build? stuff i want to have in live. nobody would care about them, nobody would understand them. but i don't care. i build stuff for my personal fun and use. that's what it's really for.

[liveISlife]

perhaps the negative reactions are the result of fear- if we loose ourselves to technology, do we loose our history and creativity if the power goes out? that's extreme, of course, but there you have it.... it's such a huge turning point right now.
scary and awesome at the same time...

Nicely put. And also, it's dudes getting pissed off when they pretty much spent there entire life learning how to play an instrument. Then, this technology comes along and some snot nose noob can play as good as them, as soulless as that playing might be. Ya really just have to laugh at it, not get pissed off. Cause I mean really, what are you going to do about it?

[DaddyHam]

I don't really think UKRuss ever said it was worthless, he just wasn't impressed as he's making some pretty good music with what he already has. The thread is about the patch, not the validity of M4L. I think the bigger picture is the direction Ableton users are taking. I've already read a couple of comments that people might shell out the cash just for this patch, which was kind of the whole point. From a purely neutral point of view will this make your music better? However, as a skeptic of the patch (not M4L in general) I'd love to hear some examples of this thing in action, especially if the composer would have typically avoided harmonic music pre Schwarzonator.

[stringtapper]

I don't really think UKRuss ever said it was worthless, he just wasn't impressed as he's making some pretty good music with what he already has. The thread is about the patch, not the validity of M4L.

I am not impressed with M4L, I have seen shit all that makes it worth the cost.

Just going by what he said.

[chapelier fou]

I am almost certain you can achieve this with a combination of random, chord, and scale midi effects. I love m4l anyway.

[ze2be]

I am almost certain you can achieve this with a combination of random, chord, and scale midi effects. I love m4l anyway.

Yes, we can do all of this with just Live 8. Except the send scale function.

[Gab]

I might have to by M4L just for this. I think it's great, just wished he used the actual cord names instead of track names.

+1.