The Schwarzonator is stupid

[Slightlydelic]

heres the tune his preset is named after.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_tkl2-fFDc

[chapelier fou]

Am I joking ?

Or am I trying to get 1000 posts ?

you're cheating.

No I'm not !

[peeddrroo]

what i don't get is the "i can play any key on my keyboard without making any mistake" part.
music IS about making mistakes and learning from them, about broadening your knowledge.
not about restricting yourself to some chords and keys someone else designed.

i think people are over reacting because they see m4l as a creative, not a restrictive tool.
but then you probably can be creative with this.

[phil909]

heres the tune his preset is named after.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_tkl2-fFDc

just imagine all the cheating that went on to make that track.

[Slightlydelic]

heres the tune his preset is named after.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_tkl2-fFDc

just imagine all the cheating that went on to make that track.

i cant, im musicly illiterate, i can ony listen and enjoy it for what i hear.

[phil909]

what i don't get is the "i can play any key on my keyboard without making any mistake" part.
music IS about making mistakes and learning from them, about broadening your knowledge.
not about restricting yourself to some chords and keys someone else designed.

i think people are over reacting because they see m4l as a creative, not a restrictive tool.
but then you probably can be creative with this.

i get your point peeddrroo, but surely by the same token you can also learn by understanding why something sounds 'right' or 'better'. you don't only learn by mistakes and things that are wrong, you learn also when things sound good.

restrictions can also be a good thing too.

[milfhuntr]

I agree 100 percent that the Schwarzonator is a very stupid and almost purposeless use of Max for Live. I would be embarrased to be involved with it.

[phil909]

perhaps this thread should be renamed 'henrik schwarz is killing music'?

[stringtapper]

the part about using this pluggin vs learning music is irrelevant imo. nobody asks synth players to know how to build a synth. someone did it for them already ; but if you want to know what's happening inside, you still can do it.
what really upsets me is this guy saying that his pluggin enables him to play "safely". to me music is not about playing safe, it's about taking risks.

I agree with your later comment but I think your analogy is flawed. Building the synth wouldn't be the equivalent of music theory. Knowing how to create sounds with the synth would. So the synth analogy should really be whether someone uses presets on their synth versus programming their own sounds.

[gRave Robber]

Wow, lots of hate here. If it makes music more accessible to a beginner im all for it. I have some friends who play waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better than I do. Im alright, nothing spectacular as I don't play with people very often but I'd like to do it more. Work, job, kids, take up lots of time so practicing to catch up to people playing for 20 years or more. The love of music isn't the skills you have, it's the music, the feelings it generates.

Never judge your skill/knowledge according to someone elses

If Schwarzonator isn't your thing, don't use it. It's petty to attack someones attempts to immerse oneself in playing with others if they couldnt do it another way, furthermore, Mr. Shwarz's efforts in the patch were well tendered, especially in his motivation for the device.

Those who hate it, it takes away nothing from you, and may give something to those with nothing.

just my 2 cents.

I know many jazz players that look at sequencing software as cheating as things aren't live to tape.

[Tone Deft]

for some reason i find it really appalling, why write/perform music if you cant take the time to learn basic chords.

you can't make something like that without knowing music theory. ever hear of the scale and chord plug ins??

this is the same guy that shits on people for not having fancy guitars? what an ass.

[cacti]

for some reason i find it really appalling, why write/perform music if you cant take the time to learn basic chords.

you can't make something like that without knowing music theory. ever hear of the scale and chord plug ins??

this is the same guy that shits on people for not having fancy guitars? what an ass.

He didnt make the scale and chord presets, and he admits not knowing much about music theory. And my thread about guitar is more humorous than anything, i dont give a shit what people use to make there music. i just see thousand dollar synths next to $200 guitars and it cracks me up.

[filterstein]

for some reason i find it really appalling, why write/perform music if you cant take the time to learn basic chords.

I find it appalling. Why write if you can not use proper capitalization?

[eggnchips]

I'm all up for it.
I agree that it's there to aid people like myself who don't care to spend hours learning music theory and improving piano skills.
I like to use that time on production, productivity and creativity.

[mikemc]

I like the conversations about 'what is cheating' and so on.

Way back, putting frets on a stringed instrument was considered dumbing down the technology: on a fretless instrument, you had to have specialized knowledge as where to put your fingers. The frets were, like, cheating.

But what this did was to enable music creation for people without specialized knowledge, and it allowed them to participate more easily in the creation of a culture that was more representative of the human totality.

The chords and harmonies in the tune that is referenced are what you'd consider advanced music theory. What knowledge of music theory does is give you choices that make more sense, rather than thinking any note will fit, you get some valid harmonic choices and have some idea of the notes you should avoid *without playing them first*.

So if these notes were maybe picked out, bit by bit through trial and error playing which was facilitated a little by software and also memorized in a chordal sequence inside the software this is not such an awful thing, is it?