Ableton and the Kaoss KP3 as an external FX processor...

[azuredeath663]

Alright, so my latest problem here is that when I use an External FX device in ableton and route it into my Kaoss Pad, the audio sounds flattened, and the bass significantly increases.

I have set up the proper in's and out's with my soundcard, however when I route the audio into the KP3, the audio sounds very flattened and bass-y.

Everything would work fine if it didn't sound so flattened and bass-y!

I don't think it's a problem with Ableton, because the audio sounds fine otherwise, and when I load up some samples into the KP3, they sound crispy clean.

Any ideas?

Here's a sound sample of what it sounds like before I send the audio to the FX box, and then when I switch it over.

test.wav - 1.33MB

Thank you for any help Check back soon---

[FORMAT]

I'll check this on my setup and report back soon.
R.

[AceLuby]

What tracks are being sent to the master? Is it only the KP return track or are the other tracks also being sent to the master channel? This could happen if both the KP return track and the other track we being sent to the master.

It sounds like you're sending everything to the master and then when you turn the KP track on the sound gets routed to it and back to the master ON TOP of the original stuff being sent to the master.

I hope this makes sense... it's pretty early.

[azuredeath663]

That makes sense, but when I try to fix it it still sounds messed up.

Here is a screenshot of a test project with the same setup as my DJ set (That pic would be an eyesore to look at)



Audio 1: Sends Only >
Return Track A: (External FX plugin: In and Out: 3/4 Stereo (This is what is hooked up to my Kp3)
Audio 2: Receiving audio from Return Track A


--Still flattened and overpowered bass sounding..--

Thank you for helping out!

[swishniak]

the ableton live routing looks ok to me. have you fiddled with setting on the KP3? or maybe tried a different effects unit? ive found that different hardware units can have many different gain / line in level issues.

[azuredeath663]

Sadly there isn't much to mess with on the KP3 that effects the input stream.

There is just the input gain, tempo control, FX release, etc.

The sound is distorted with no FX being played, which is my biggest problem.

I found a temporary work around, if I set up an EQ 8 on the track that is receiving the KP3 audio, and adjust it a bit, it *almost* sounds the same, but it's still slightly different.

I think I may end up using this setup for now, most people won't notice the slight change in audio quality...

Aside from this, I noticed though that my KP3 is actually sending back some feedback!

This should not be happening, as one of the RCAs I have hooked up has a feedback loop eliminator box...

I'm so frustrated ...

If it helps any, the sound card I am using is the Native Instruments Audio 8 DJ.


I can't figure out if it's the KP3's problem, the sound card, or ableton.

[hps909]

have you got the KP3 set to direct (insert) or return (send)... should have a switch on the back if it's set on direct the input signal will pass through unaffected which is why your getting a doubled signal at abletons master .. switch to return (i think thats what it's called ) and you will only get an effected signal through when you tough the pad .. also you have adjust your input level something fierce otherwise it will jump out real loud

[azuredeath663]

have you got the KP3 set to direct (insert) or return (send)... should have a switch on the back if it's set on direct the input signal will pass through unaffected which is why your getting a doubled signal at abletons master .. switch to return (i think thats what it's called ) and you will only get an effected signal through when you tough the pad .. also you have adjust your input level something fierce otherwise it will jump out real loud

Alright, the back switch is DIRECT and SEND.

I read through the manual and it agrees with you and recommends to use SEND mode for my particular situation.

However when I do this, the signal is STILL flattened, no matter which effect I use.


Above that, the feedback sound is still there (The very light static sound). I am using a feedback loop eliminator RCA cable w/ box, so I don't understand why this is happening.



I'm beginning to think the problem lies within the KP3 and it's ability to process sound and resend it.

I've tried many different inputs and outputs to make sure it wasn't just the sound card's channel that was giving me the error.


Are there any other ideas?
I really really appreciate everybody's continued help!!


Edit>> I did some testing, and hooked up my monitors to the direct output of the KP3. The signal sounded Perfect and Crisp, this way...So I am either setting up the routing incorrectly in ableton, or the audio is somehow becoming distorted when it is being sent back into the soundcard.

[FORMAT]

You need to decrease INPUT VOLUME (top left knob) if distortion is the problem.
I've noticed that routing signal through the Kaoss Pad significantly reduces the volume. To make up for that, you'll have to put a Gainer tool where the signal flows back into Live.

[divonic]

I could be wrong (and I'm not at my DAW at the moment) but I think that your problem is in your routing. try setting it up this way. 1-audio set to Auto with audio out set to master. add the external effect to send track A and set its I/O up as needed for your sound card setup. Set the output for Send A to Master. Set the KP3 to sends. turn the send knob on 1-Audio to 0. play your clip on 1-audio you should hear the clip playing un-effected. now turn up the send in 1-Audio and you should hear the effected audio blended with the original dry signal in the master.

[azuredeath663]

@ Format -- The input volume is at almost 5% of the available 100% (It's very sensitive), any lower and the audio does not stream through properly, any higher and it vastly overpowers... so messing with this knob does not fix my problem =(

I could be wrong (and I'm not at my DAW at the moment) but I think that your problem is in your routing. try setting it up this way. 1-audio set to Auto with audio out set to master. add the external effect to send track A and set its I/O up as needed for your sound card setup. Set the output for Send A to Master. Set the KP3 to sends. turn the send knob on 1-Audio to 0. play your clip on 1-audio you should hear the clip playing un-effected. now turn up the send in 1-Audio and you should hear the effected audio blended with the original dry signal in the master.

This method works, but what I am trying to achieve is full control of the entire signal into my Kp3, with unaffected audio...

When I do this, the sound is nice, but the FX are heard blended into the dry signal, as you said...

Though... the more I play with this, the more I'm beginning to like what I can do with this...I will still be able to sample.

I think I may stick with this setup, if the one I want to make is not possible...

Thank you!

[divonic]

In that case add the external effect to the track itself (1-Audio) and flip the switch on the back of the KP3 to direct. you will only be able to use the KP3 on that one track but all the signal running from 1-Audio will go to the KP3 and through the KP3. you can adjust the wet/dry on the KP3 using the FX depth knob.

[azuredeath663]

In that case add the external effect to the track itself (1-Audio) and flip the switch on the back of the KP3 to direct. you will only be able to use the KP3 on that one track but all the signal running from 1-Audio will go to the KP3 and through the KP3. you can adjust the wet/dry on the KP3 using the FX depth knob.

this method produces the same flattened bass sound...

this makes absolutely no sense why this is happening >_<

When I wear the headphones connected to the Kp3, the sound is nice and clear. But when ableton receives the signal back, it comes back muddy and flattened.

[divonic]

Weird. I'm gonna have to try my KP3 in direct mode and see what happens.

[anamexis]

In that case add the external effect to the track itself (1-Audio) and flip the switch on the back of the KP3 to direct. you will only be able to use the KP3 on that one track but all the signal running from 1-Audio will go to the KP3 and through the KP3. you can adjust the wet/dry on the KP3 using the FX depth knob.

this method produces the same flattened bass sound...

this makes absolutely no sense why this is happening >_<

When I wear the headphones connected to the Kp3, the sound is nice and clear. But when ableton receives the signal back, it comes back muddy and flattened.

Could it maybe be your audio interface ins? Do you have any other inputs to compare against?