Clips still play out of sync in new 2.02 update-bugfix-

fuentes925 · Post by **fuentes925** » Sat Feb 15, 2003 9:30 am

I am still getting a random clip that will play out of sync in the session view. It was stated that this was a bug that was fixed in 2.02 but it seems to still be there. This is a horrible bug that causes me much worry. Does any body else have this problem or could this be some thing caused by my gear? It will happen when I trigger scenes with my lap top keyboard and mouse but it seems to happen more often when I trigger a scene with my midi controller keyboard.

My gear list:
Sony Vaio grx520 P4 1.6mhz 512ram 30hd

Motu 828 firewire

Evolution mk225-c midi controller

Ableton Live 2.02

reasons

FrankH · Post by **FrankH** » Sat Feb 15, 2003 5:20 pm

fuentes925 wrote:I am still getting a random clip that will play out of sync in the session view.

In spite of the hard work the A-Team did in the last hours, sorry guy's.
The out-of-sync bug has become worse

It became even more audioble.
Now the clips start is OK but after a couple of measures the tracks start to drift appart very clearly.

Peace,
f

fuentes925 · Post by **fuentes925** » Sat Feb 15, 2003 6:42 pm

My out of sync clips will happen right from the start and I have to retrigger the scene to get every thing back in sync. I have not had the problem of them drifting out of sync after a few bars. it has always been from the start for me. any word on this problem Ableton or on a possible fix?

FrankH · Post by **FrankH** » Sat Feb 15, 2003 7:09 pm

fuentes925 wrote:...I have not had the problem of them drifting out of sync after a few bars...

Hm, that's interesting. Let's see if this has something to do with the OS?
I use Live 2.0.2 on MacOS 9.2.2 with a MOTU 2408 (mark one).
fuentes925 do you also use OS 9.2.2?

fuentes925 · Post by **fuentes925** » Sat Feb 15, 2003 7:53 pm

I actualy use PC not Mac, running widows XP. See my first post for complete gear list. I hope this bug can be fixed soon.

FrankH · Post by **FrankH** » Sat Feb 15, 2003 7:58 pm

Hi,

I did an other check, in my situation in Live 2.0.2 it is not the individual clips that drift appart, it is all clips against the songtempo. So it's all clips vs my MachineDrum that gets it's clock from Live.

Peace,
f

FrankH · Post by **FrankH** » Sat Feb 15, 2003 8:22 pm

Hi,

Crosschecked with Live 1.5.2 and no problem, everything stayes in sync.

f

fuentes925 · Post by **fuentes925** » Sat Feb 15, 2003 8:26 pm

Same here, Live 1.52 all in sync--Live 2.02 random out of sync clips.

Gerhard · Post by **Gerhard** » Sun Feb 16, 2003 7:21 pm

Gentlemen,

please take the time to read the following thoroughly as we need you to understand some background so you can help us trace down the problem.

First, we should rule out MIDI sync-related problems. A drift of Live's internal tempo with respect to an external tempo source in a MIDI sync scenario has nothing to do with clips drifting *within* Live. Should you find MIDI sync-related drifts, please use a separate thread to post your observation.

As for clips drifting with respect to one another, here is what I know about the problem:

There was an issue with very small rounding errors that resulted in audible phasings for short loops. This has been fixed for 2.0.2.

There is another issue which I guess is what you are talking about. This is about clips that have odd loop lengths, like 7.3.3 plus something instead of 8.0.0. When such a clip is running in the Session View, the Track Status Field will show a '7+' loop length next to the pie chart.

It is easy to create such clips. When a clip is set to play unwarped, you can adjust the clip region (aka loop) in milliseconds rather than sixteenth notes; when warping is re-activated, the region / loop length is likely not be a "round" musical loop. We have also seen clips with an *almost* round loop in Live Sets that were created with an old Live version.

Anyhow, in case of a such a clip with an unround loop, the fix is easy: dragging the loop start and end marker makes them snap to sixteenth notes.

I would like to know from you: can you confirm that your drifting clips have an unround loop length? After dragging the loop markers to snap them to sixteenths, is the problem fixed?

Thank you

Gerhard / ableton

fuentes925 · Post by **fuentes925** » Sun Feb 16, 2003 8:22 pm

My problem is not drifting loops, for me when I trigger a new scene some times there will be a random loop out of sync. Then I have to re trigger the scene and it well then be in sync and stay in sync. I did a test with a drum rythm sample, I set the same sample to scene 1 track 1 and 2 and left the sample as is in a round 8.0 length loop, and this would always play in sync with no problems. In scene 2 track 1 I played the same sample unchanged and in scene 2 track 2 I added the same loop, but this time I cut the loop to a 4.0 length which should still be a rounded loop as it is set to the warp markers. In scene 2 it was possible to get the 2 drum samples to play out of sync right from the time it was triggered, I would then retrigger scene 2 and every thing would be in sync with no drifting out of sync. So it seems that Ableton Live is having trouble triggering samples that have modified loop lengths even if the loop is a round loop. This problem for me happens maybe 2 out of 10 times when triggering scenes and the result sounds like a d.j. train wreck which sounds horrible. So I have to quickly retrigger the scene to get every thing back in sync.
I hope this can be worked out as it is a big problem for me. I am scared to use Live in a live situation due to this problem, and this is the main reason I bought this program.

fuentes925 · Post by **fuentes925** » Sun Feb 16, 2003 8:54 pm

It seems that this is not a common problem, since there is not alot of complaints about it. Is any body else having this problem?

fuentes925 · Post by **fuentes925** » Sun Feb 16, 2003 10:30 pm

I am sorry but in my first test I forgot to state that some of those loops had the off set marker set to some thing other than the 1 warp marker. After further test I found that no matter the length of the clip as long as the off set marker was on 1 warp marker the clips would always play in sync. But as soon as I would change the position of the off set marker to any thing other than the 1 warp marker I would get out of sync clips. Clips playing out of sync would happen about 2% of the time when triggering scenes, and a retrigger of the scene would often set things back in sync. So it seems the cause of my out of sync clips is due to the off set marker and not the lenght of the clip or warp marker setting.

guvnorbeats · Post by **guvnorbeats** » Sun Feb 16, 2003 10:58 pm

it sounds to me like you may have some differing quantization settings.

Check to be sure both the Quantization session menu is set to something conducvie to your live set (bar or 1/4 note is what I like to use).

Then, make sure that the ALL of the clips you are triggering have the Global quantization setting (to use the same setting as you registered above). You will have to click into each loop to verify this.

One other possibility is that your tranisent settings is too "loose" for your loops. Again, click into the loops and try setting transients to the highest (most frequent) setting 1/32 note as an experiment.

The strangest thing about your problem is that it happens only sometimes. This makes me think that you have "none" as your quantization setting on one of your clips" and the inconsistancy is a result of your timing . . . hey on the bright side you're nailing it 8 out of 10 times!!

hope this helps . . . good luck!

guv

Pitch Black · Post by **Pitch Black** » Sun Feb 16, 2003 11:23 pm

hi fuentes

there is definately a bug with clips that have a start other than "1" not triggering when in MIDI slave mode. -ie chasing MIDI clock. That is known and Ableton are working on it.
I cant say, but maybe your problem is related to that bug?

cheers

paddy

fuentes925 · Post by **fuentes925** » Sun Feb 16, 2003 11:49 pm

OH Boy do I feel like a fool

Thank you Guv.
I followed your instructons for setting up quantisation, and then I tried for 15 minutes to try and get a clip out of sync and I could not do it. So you solved my problem. I did not think this was caused by Live because there would have surely been more complaints about it. It was caused by my inexperience, so I will learn from my mistake and move on.

Thank you again.
fuentes925

Clips still play out of sync in new 2.02 update-bugfix-

Clips still play out of sync in new 2.02 update-bugfix-

Re: Clips still play out of sync in new 2.02 update-bugfix-

OS?

not individual clips, but clips vs the songtempo

crosscheck with Live 1.5.2

Thank you Guv.