NO thanks for now on the VSTi/midi thing...

Mbazzy · Post by **Mbazzy** » Thu Feb 20, 2003 7:53 pm

Heard through the grapevine that Xlutop's Chainer might be going Rewire as well ..

datagroove · Post by **datagroove** » Thu Feb 20, 2003 9:09 pm

As I went to bed just seconds after my post last night.. I now awake with a smile

on my face as i see my thoughts on the subject have not been flamed - but agreed with and added to.

Kick ass!

I am digging the concept of separate app for handling midi- great idea- (instead of having it in Live just use Rewire or some kind of propriety protocol for communicating between the two apps)

“Guest” addressed the idea of more sample editing in the clip view. I completely agree and have posted my thoughts on this in the past in the wish list forum (I suggest you add your thoughts there)

keep em coming folks –pro or con- I have a feeling Ableton is listening

datagroove

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Feb 20, 2003 10:41 pm

Mbassy, when you were saying "there might be something around the corner", were you talking about an upcoming product of a well known american software company (I just read about it)?

... which features rewire client... vsti host... (an many others like sequencing and stuffs I really don't give a damn as I will never use them but anyway

)... it looks like it could be the perfect LIVE's soulmate

was it

Mbazzy · Post by **Mbazzy** » Thu Feb 20, 2003 10:57 pm

no ... look further back in time .... and maybe read a bit in between the lines

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Feb 20, 2003 11:03 pm

datagroove wrote: I have a feeling Ableton is listening
datagroove

I'm sure that Ableton listens very closely to what gets said on these forums. Despite the fact that most of the posts in this thread are against introducing MIDI to Live, the majority of the opinions expressed across all the forums to date has been in favour.

Of particular interest to Ableton, I would have thought, is that the lack of MIDI is one of the main reasons given by people who have decided that Live is not for them. Keeping existing users happy is important of course but so is attracting new users.

Andrew K · Post by **Andrew K** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 5:23 am

I think LIVE found a wonderful niche in the music production world. If you want Rewire, VST instruments and midi... get Cubase. If you a Rewire and midi get Logic.

Can you imagine what Ableton would have to do to compete with Steinberg and Apple/Emagic on the Midi/audio production front???

I say... let Ableton make LIVE the best application of it's kind with the BEST integration.... not another watered down "trying to be everything at the same time" application.

Andrew K

os · Post by os » Fri Feb 21, 2003 9:09 am

Andrew K wrote:Can you imagine what Ableton would have to do to compete with Steinberg and Apple/Emagic on the Midi/audio production front???

Adding VSTi support doesn't necessarily mean they're competing with Cubase/Logic - for me, Live is all about live work, not studio work.
Which brings me to a slight concern I have with where Ableton might be taking Live already - with version 2.0 we have all these new "multitrack recording studio" features, which seems to be taking Live into competition with e.g. Cubase. Live used to be all about being a rock-solid base for live performance/jamming, not studio work. Which is why I would personally love to see VSTi support, so I could play softsynths live from a keyboard without worrying about another host app to confuse the situation. (I have Cubase for studio work.)

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 1:49 pm

I'm just getting into live and I definitly don't think they should add midi or VSTi capability. Besides with all the support ReWire is getting now, it just seems completely unnecessary. I mean think about the stuff that's out there and that will be available:

1. Propellerhead's Reason.
http://www.propellerheads.se/products/reason/frame.html

2. Propellerhead's Rebirth.
http://www.propellerheads.se/products/r ... frame.html

3. Cakewalk's upcoming P5, which is a host for DXi and VSTi.
http://www.cakewalk.com/Products/Project5/default.asp

4. Speedsoft's VSampler3.
http://www.virtualsampler.de/vs3/frame_intro2.html

5. Bitheadz Unity DS-1.
http://www.bitheadz.com/prod/DS1/main.htm

6. Bitheadz Unity AS-1.
http://www.bitheadz.com/prod/AS1/main.htm

7. VSTiHOST
http://www.defectiverecords.com/vstihost/details.html

and possibly (from rumors)

8. Tascam's GigaStudio

9. Native Instrument's Kontakt and Reaktor.

What more is necessary?

I definitly vote to keep Live midi sequencer and softsynth free.

If Live just keeps enhancing their ReWire support, then it'll be all set.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 2:43 pm

Or how about muzys ? Haven't tried it yet but from the spec it appears to offer Rewire, VSTi plus performance oriented features such as triggering sequences via MIDI. Does anyone have any experience running muzys and Live together ?

andreas · Post by **andreas** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 3:38 pm

vsti hosting and the ability to send midi-notes
(from midiport) to the plugs would really be great..

on a separate channel to not conflict with
clip triggering..

i dont mean sequencing, just hosting vstI's and midiIn->plugin..
...play the instruments LIVE !

much of the vst specs is in there already, so..

regards
°/andreas

globalgoon · Post by **globalgoon** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 4:26 pm

clips that play midi notes would make live stand out from cubase etc.

ryansupak · Post by **ryansupak** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 5:06 pm

ableton,

i love you just the way you are. i hope you never change. :P

my $0.02,
rs

Pitch Black · Post by **Pitch Black** » Sat Feb 22, 2003 5:02 am

I would like to see a *very basic* midi clip functionality added. Some sounds that i make in my S3200 can't be "freeze-dried" into audio clips.
for me there is a big difference between moving a filter over an entire pre-recorded clip, and modulating filters within the notes. eg an envelope gives an acid filter sound some shape while I control the overall cutoff via mod wheel.

in Logic there is an "export sequence as standard midi file" command. I would love to be able to drop one of those into a slot alongside my audio clips. I am not asking for ANY midi editing or so forth - I can do that fine in Logic - but for me, that ability to trigger chunks of midi would be great for playing live.

I fully appreciate that Live's priority is AUDIO manipulation - lets face it, there's none better - and I would be completely happy to wait for the current bugs to be fixed and new audio features added before midi gets added to the "to do" list. And if it can't be done without jeopardizing Live's stability then absolutely DONT DO IT. But if it could be added sometime in the distant future It would make me very happy.

respect

paddy

borg · Post by **borg** » Sun Feb 23, 2003 12:52 pm

globalgoon, pitch black and i share the same wishes...

midi clips... yes. just two tracks would be great already

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon Feb 24, 2003 10:30 pm

If I wre the head dude at 'Live' Heres what I would do.

I would have 2 versions of LIVE. Obviously Live and Studio version.

Live has only audio capability

Studio has audio and midi capability

Studio is priced alongside the current 3 or 4 DAWS out there and Live is picthed at a couple of hundred less than the fully featured version, just as it is now actually.

And for those that wish to swicth to the studio version they simply pay the upgrade cost. Note how I didnt say upgrade to studio Version because it should not be marketeed as an upgrade ever. It is merely a version that does not include midi because the user doesnt need that ability.

For other companies in the past I have always had a feeling that they wouldnt quite get this approach right for many reasons. However my gut feeling tells me that Ableton could pull this one off and be pretty successfull, and quite easily give the others a very good run for their money as well.

This way Ableton will get themselves out of potentially endless requests for midi features. Will it ever stop...? I doubt it. Why? because the way Live manipulates audio is just to damn tempting for traditional DAW users. I bet you right now there are hundreds of Cubase, Logic, Sonar, PT's users looking at Live and thinking. "I wish my software could do that". so they may buy Live use it, but eventually it becomes to hard to resist. After a while the studio Live user want to play that Memory Moog all synced up with live. Its Easier..< its nicer to wrok with only one program.

seems to me Ableton have a choice to make. To midi or to not. If I was an Ableton exec I would definitely be looking around and ....wondering. What if?

If Ableton take a decsion and decide to remain midiless I will actually support and still use Live. However, if that is Abletons decision I am pretty certain the other bunch will be looking at whats cool in Live at be looking at sticking some of that software. As time goes on they might even get pretty good at doing what Live can do. Then it comes down to the music store salesman. "Yeh dude Live is cool, it warps audio n all that. But dude so does 'Bostik, and Spacecase' AND you can play that memory moog with them as well"

NO thanks for now on the VSTi/midi thing...

let me guess...