Alternative to ReWire

MarkRM · Post by **MarkRM** » Sun May 22, 2005 5:56 pm

I'm interested in using Cubase SX3 and Ableton together in my live show. I want to have pre-prepared tracks playing back in Cubase at the same time as I 'play' Ableton over the top. For this to work, I have to have Ableton synced up to Cubase's tempo track. In the past I've synced them using Rewire but recently the limitations of this have been getting me down (I want Live's I/O still to be active so I can record and playback in realtime using Live, put vocals through Live in realtime, etc.).

It seems like the only way I can have full-functionality in both programs is to sync them up using MIDI Clock. So I went and got MIDI Yoke and installed it, but I'm having real problems with it. My tempo track in Cubase has lots of tempo changes and the MIDI Clock doesn't like this. It's slow to respond. Which wouldn't be too much of a problem if it was working more or less correctly: the sync between both programs is badly out of whack; to the point where it's useless ... I can't get them synced ... Ableton's sync delay doesn't delay long enough to line both programs up, but I get the feeling that it shouldn't need to.

I'm feeling a little defeated. Has anyone got any suggestions? What's a good alternative to Rewire which retains Ableton's functionality when synced? How would I go about getting Ableton running in all its glory, synced to my tempo track in Cubase SX? Any help/ideas would be much appreciated!

clipperer · Post by **clipperer** » Sun May 22, 2005 7:39 pm

you could rec cubase sx song into live and do whatever you want live. so the recorded song will be tempo sinced in live, you can change everything.

ohh what...

montrealbreaks · Post by **montrealbreaks** » Sun May 22, 2005 8:07 pm

MarkRM wrote:I'm interested in using Cubase SX3 and Ableton together in my live show. I want to have pre-prepared tracks playing back in Cubase at the same time as I 'play' Ableton over the top.

Forgive me if this sounds like tired fanboi tripe, but is it really necessary to play your prepared tracks in Cubase? Could you not export them with whatever Cubase effects you use and put them in their own tracks within Live? Then, just lay everything out in the Arrange Window, and leave "extra" channels in Live for your clips in session view.

You can do tempo changes in Ableton. It seems to me you're trying to get two programs to do what one could do easily...

Just a thought. Check out the Arrange View in your manual, and check out the master channel in the arrange view - you can automate the tempo there.

MarkRM · Post by **MarkRM** » Mon May 23, 2005 5:10 am

Montrealbreaks, the tempo changes are specific to Cubase SX. The tempo track I have already worked out in Cubase is 'embedded' into the audio files. So unless there is some way to export the (complex) tempo track from Cubase into Live the audio will not sync to Live. This is why I'm using SX. I'm also sending a click track to a drummer and have just found that it's easier to manage this from within Cubase.

MarkRM · Post by **MarkRM** » Mon May 23, 2005 5:15 am

Clipperer, how would I record the audio from Cubase into Live? I know I could just export the audio files but then they will not by synced to Live on playback (because, as I've mentioned, Cubase's tempo track is embedded into the files). Do you know how this could work?

MarkRM · Post by **MarkRM** » Mon May 23, 2005 5:40 am

Oops, one thing I also forgot to mention.

Montrealbreaks, I've been using Cubase SX also because I use DirectX plugins on the master out of the preprepared tracks. This is one area where Live doesn't compare to SX. I've tried the FFX4 wrapper and found it to be not great. None of my plugins ever 'stick', which means I have to manually reload them every time I open a file. Because I use a number of different Live files in the course of a set this slows things down.

montrealbreaks · Post by **montrealbreaks** » Mon May 23, 2005 5:57 am

MarkRM wrote:Montrealbreaks, the tempo changes are specific to Cubase SX. The tempo track I have already worked out in Cubase is 'embedded' into the audio files. So unless there is some way to export the (complex) tempo track from Cubase into Live the audio will not sync to Live. This is why I'm using SX. I'm also sending a click track to a drummer and have just found that it's easier to manage this from within Cubase.

Well, you could warp your tracks by inserting warp markers and then changing the tempo in live - but I agree, this is a convoluted, pointless exercise if the finished audio files already have tempo changes in them.

Plus as you mention the DX plugs, and switching Live sets. I didn't know these things, so it seems like you're on the right track. But I have no real solutions for your timing issues, other than to wish you luck unforunately...

What about sending MIDI sync only through hardware out the computer and back in again through a second interface? Is that an option?

MarkRM · Post by **MarkRM** » Mon May 23, 2005 6:14 am

I can't try your suggestion with my current setup, but it would seem that because it's still a MIDI Clock signal the syncing problems would remain (especially considering I'd probably have to route the signal through something like MIDI Yoke anyway). It seems as if other people have used MIDI Yoke and not had these issues, but I guess every system is different.

I actually thought that maybe if I synced up Ableton to Cubase using ReWire (which seems pretty precise) I might be able to 'record' the tempo changes in Ableton as tempo automation ... so that when I reopened the Ableton file by itself it would have learned Cubase's tempo track and I could just dump the files in there and it would sync perfectly. But this was wishful thinking. If it'd had worked, I'd have learned to live with that annoying DX to VST wrapper.

But thanks for your suggestions. If anyone else has any ideas I'd love to hear them.

Alternative to ReWire

Alternative to ReWire

Re: Alternative to ReWire