Trance-Gate

[seattletruth]

A fully programmable trancegate would be nice. Its a pain in the ass to use gate side chaining.

[hoffman2k]

Live is a Trance-Gate. You can edit the volume with Clip Envelopes Automation. That part does exactly the same as that VST. The other things like delay and filtering can be added with Audio Effects. Which in turn can also be automated.

[JBlongz]

ITs totally NOT the same as having a dedicated transgate. I use NEXUS 2, which has a built-in transgate and its has a long list of presets to quickly jump between different patterns and the ability to add patterns. Clip enveloping is like stone age, and time consuming. I bought GateBoy from SineVibes for $30 just to get that type of functionality for mac. Izotope just released StutterEdit, which has a sequenced gated feature among many others. Not many people out there making them as an independent plugin.

[hoffman2k]

ITs totally NOT the same as having a dedicated transgate. I use NEXUS 2, which has a built-in transgate and its has a long list of presets to quickly jump between different patterns and the ability to add patterns. Clip enveloping is like stone age, and time consuming. I bought GateBoy from SineVibes for $30 just to get that type of functionality for mac. Izotope just released StutterEdit, which has a sequenced gated feature among many others. Not many people out there making them as an independent plugin.

Ah. Thought he was mentioning a specific plugin called trance-gate. Didn't realize every sequential gate effect is called a trance-gate. Its a chopper in my vocabulary. Live and learn

[ninox_rufa]

Live is a Trance-Gate. You can edit the volume with Clip Envelopes Automation. That part does exactly the same as that VST. The other things like delay and filtering can be added with Audio Effects. Which in turn can also be automated.

Clip Envelope Automation for a trance gate don't work well either because (as I'm sure you know) automation isn't delay compensated. You can get away with it for some effects but when you draw envelopes for rapid gates they sound out of time.

I bought GateBoy from SineVibes for $30 just to get that type of functionality for mac.

Gate plugins don't fair any better for different reasons. Don't you find that it sounds bad?

http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=157048

[hoffman2k]

If plugin latency gets out of hand, I save and reload the set. That usually tightens things up a little.
But I don't use that many 3rd party plugins and the ones I do use, work fine.
I tried that test from the other thread and was able to make everything cancel out. I suppose my plugins are more efficient.

[ninox_rufa]

Really wow! What plugins are you using? I haven't tried all my plugins but the ones I did try all produced audible results. I'm curious because the nature of the problem should mean that unless a plugin has absolute zero latency (which is rare) the tracks will not phase cancel.

[hoffman2k]

Really wow! What plugins are you using? I haven't tried all my plugins but the ones I did try all produced audible results. I'm curious because the nature of the problem should mean that unless a plugin has absolute zero latency (which is rare) the tracks will not phase cancel.

I tried this with ABL Pro FX and LA Convolver. 2 plugins that seem like they'd make a dent.
Maybe I did it wrong, but following your steps in a 2 track set doesn't show me the problem.
The plugins I used must be properly reporting their latency.

[ninox_rufa]

I tried this with ABL Pro FX and LA Convolver. 2 plugins that seem like they'd make a dent.
Maybe I did it wrong, but following your steps in a 2 track set doesn't show me the problem.

Hi sorry for the continued questions but I need to clarify. Do you mean you did something like this:

Track 1: Sample -> Beat Repeat
Track 2: Sample -> ABL Pro FX -> Beat Repeat -> Utility with phase invert

The plugins I used must be properly reporting their latency.

This sentence makes me wonder if I haven't explained clearly enough. The problem isn't Live incorrectly handling plugin latency. In fact it's the plugins reporting their latency and Live correctly adjusting for the latency that actually causes the issue:

A plugin reports it's latency to Live. Live adjusts the audio of the track to compensate. But Live does not adjust the timing of the stutter,gate,sync,LFO etc by the same amount. It ignores it. So Beat Repeat behaves as if the total latency of the track is zero. But it isn't. This means that the effect ends up out of time.

[hoffman2k]

I tried this with ABL Pro FX and LA Convolver. 2 plugins that seem like they'd make a dent.
Maybe I did it wrong, but following your steps in a 2 track set doesn't show me the problem.

Hi sorry for the continued questions but I need to clarify. Do you mean you did something like this:

Track 1: Sample -> Beat Repeat
Track 2: Sample -> ABL Pro FX -> Beat Repeat -> Utility with phase invert

The plugins I used must be properly reporting their latency.

This sentence makes me wonder if I haven't explained clearly enough. The problem isn't Live incorrectly handling plugin latency. In fact it's the plugins reporting their latency and Live correctly adjusting for the latency that actually causes the issue:

A plugin reports it's latency to Live. Live adjusts the audio of the track to compensate. But Live does not adjust the timing of the stutter,gate,sync,LFO etc by the same amount. It ignores it. So Beat Repeat behaves as if the total latency of the track is zero. But it isn't. This means that the effect ends up out of time.

Got it. The repeat effect is off by 1/256th and happens just before its supposed to.
I went wrong in the earlier test by routing track 1 to 2 and using one beat repeat.

[Der_Makrophag]

A fully programmable trancegate would be nice. Its a pain in the ass to use gate side chaining.

I built my own gate (gates volume, filter or both) in NI Reaktor, that is triggered by MIDI notes, so I can programm the patterns in a MDID clip. However I did not upload it to the UL an dI bet there are some other gates around there.

Live is a Trance-Gate. You can edit the volume with Clip Envelopes Automation. That part does exactly the same as that VST. The other things like delay and filtering can be added with Audio Effects. Which in turn can also be automated.

This I also use sometimes, as you say, you can "gate" every effekt there. But having preset curves (like saw sine, exp...) there and in Automation would make it much easier.

[JBlongz]

I have reaktor, but never had the time to explore how to create gates and a nice user interface.

[jeremiahlogan]

STOP TALKING GREEK AND YOU WILL UNDERSTAND EACH OTHER.


caps for emphasis.