THE VESTAX vcm-600 CONTROLLER

[yush]

DOES anyone have this controller yet?
Are all the knobs custom assignable?
I want to be able to assign each knob to whatever I want on the UI and the same for the faders.
And also is it worth the price ?
700 is steep.
Or is UC 33E probably the best option for 1/7th of the cost?
any suggestions please..

[Forge.]

you can assign them to anything you like that can be assigned in MIDI map mode

I think it is definitely worth the money in that the thing will probably last you 20 years. It's the most solid controller I've seen and much more like a real DJ mixer.

the downside is it's big, and heavy. If you are planning on doing proper live sets that are more than just DJ sets and will use all those channels then it's really a very good controller. But for me I find that a lot of the time I only want the first 2 channels and it is way too big and heavy to take to a gig just for that.

It's the kind of thing that in an ideal world would be built into a club, but in the real world means lugging a big heavy bit of kit to a gig.

Still, it can be done and it can be worth it. A travel suitcase with wheels makes it not that much of an issue.

As for the UC33 - no comparison really - I've had mine for several years and it just sits in a cupboard. I found it way less easy to set up and it has no where near as many controls as the VCM600.

One thing I will say though, recently I got a launchpad and a Korg nanoKontrol and they are a really good VERY portable combo and very cheap and at the same time still tough. Much more realistic for gigging because they can fit in the same backpack as your laptop and while they are tough, even if something happens to one of them they are really cheap to replace. The VCM600 is more fun and intuitive for DJ mixing etc, but the portability etc of the LP + nK make it worth the extra effort.

TBH for a long time I kept feeling like I needed all these different controllers to make the "right" setup, but now I find I have too many controls and don't know what to do with them all.

[yush]

THANKS A LOT FOR THE REPLYS GUYS
the need for this controller is based upon a few things
a) midi control on productions---- most of the times i tend to use my mouse for automation curves but with more knobs i can control the parameters more real time while producing.
b) for mixing -- I have started to compile a monthly series called my state of mind and one or two tracks in these are special mash-ups or remixes I do just for the set--- in those situations--- lots of knobs and faders give me more control -- case in point --- controlling the eq filters l , m, h while using fade to grey and reverb/etcetc effects--- with my current setup - a trigger finger-- you can guess how limited that can be

UC 33E-- is this fully midi assignable as well?
Its available for only 100 bucks on ebay as opposed to this being available for a lot more than that.
you can check out my tracks and sets at
soundcloud.com/ashamock

[Forge.]

THANKS A LOT FOR THE REPLYS GUYS
the need for this controller is based upon a few things
a) midi control on productions---- most of the times i tend to use my mouse for automation curves but with more knobs i can control the parameters more real time while producing.
b) for mixing -- I have started to compile a monthly series called my state of mind and one or two tracks in these are special mash-ups or remixes I do just for the set--- in those situations--- lots of knobs and faders give me more control -- case in point --- controlling the eq filters l , m, h while using fade to grey and reverb/etcetc effects--- with my current setup - a trigger finger-- you can guess how limited that can be

UC 33E-- is this fully midi assignable as well?
Its available for only 100 bucks on ebay as opposed to this being available for a lot more than that.
you can check out my tracks and sets at
soundcloud.com/ashamock

the VCM600 would be really good for the b) situation- that's what I enjoy it the most for is that kind of mixing

trouble with the UC33 is you only have 9 faders and 8 rows of 3 knobs. this will mean you can map the knobs to low/mid/high and forego the 8 macro knobs that you could use for instant mapping, but you could use the buttons to switch between alternative mappings. This would be fiddly and TBH I never got around to setting it up because I realised I just wouldn't want to have to fiddle around like that in mission critical situations. What I did when I was using it as a DJ mixer was just used the first 4 knobs and faders for 4 tracks, then used the second lot of 4 to control 4 x sends for those 4 tracks.... it was still fiddly and not ideal.

Having said all that there is a guy who posts on this forum called "phat controller" who made some templates and recently had a sale and was selling them all for 5E or something like that.

But the alternative experience with the VCM600 - there are already 3 knobs for the EQ, with kill switches, and I over-rode (over-rided? over-rid????) the mapping so that I could set the max to 0 and used the Freq and Res buttons to control the Low and High frequency settings so that I could sweep them, rather than just using an autofilter and choosing either LPF or HPF.

Then there is a pan knob - never understood why that was there as I just would not pan in a club during a set, due to mono club systems if nothing else, but it has 2 buttons along side it as well. I used 1 of the buttons as an on/off for the EQ3 plugin (which stays lit up when the EQ is on if you enable the remote OUT ON button in the prefs) and the other button I was using to turn on a compressor and using the Pan knob to control the thresh/ratio and gain settings all at once. I have a feeling I may have changed this though but I can't remember off hand, it's a while since I've looked at it.

Then you have 3 more buttons above the play/stop buttons which I mapped to the device title bars on 3 different racks so that the 8 macro knobs in the top right could be used to control the 3 different FX racks per track. The buttons are normally "crossfade assign" which I would never use, and clip and track buttons so you could choose clip or track view. Actually now that I mention it sometimes I would actually want the clip/track buttons and would only use one FX rack on those tracks.

You also have 8 "bank" buttons under the 8 macro knobs. If you like using the more in depth 'instant mapping' where you can control Operator etc and switch banks then you can just leave these as they are, but I don't so that's an extra 8 buttons that light up when selected that you can use to select different FX racks, usually on the master.

You also have controls for the 2 return tracks - again there is at least one or 2 buttons for selecting racks and a bunch of other controls......

anyway, however you set it up, you can see that you can do a hell of a lot more with the VCM600 - I would hate to try and do all that with the UC33

the other major advantage is that it's really clear and easy to see what's going on. That is the main thing that put me off trying to use something like the UC33 - and it still is a major deterrent against making do with the nanoKontrol.

[moreofmorris]

I purchased my Vestax VCM 600 about six months ago.

I personally love it. I think it's a great piece of kit. Built like brick shit house and is clearly laid out. It's definitely more a sketch pad controller when it comes to producing with it. I almost always start off most of my tunes by using it. You can quickly build up a small 6 channel set with your ideas, and rock with them pretty quickly. But I always find with ANY controller, if it's Vestax, Akai, Native Instruments... You will always need to go back to the keyboard and mouse to get into the details. That's one thing I've realised after purchasing MANY controllers in my time, there is no holy grail, there is nothing that will be perfect, so cut it down to what is it you really want. The Vestax, for me, is a sketch pad controller for my productions, something fun to mess with if I have a producer mate round, and it is a great performance controller (though a little heavy).

I've been looking at those ClyphX clip scripts to make this Vestax really shine...
http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=153113

[yush]

I purchased my Vestax VCM 600 about six months ago.

I personally love it. I think it's a great piece of kit. Built like brick shit house and is clearly laid out. It's definitely more a sketch pad controller when it comes to producing with it. I almost always start off most of my tunes by using it. You can quickly build up a small 6 channel set with your ideas, and rock with them pretty quickly. But I always find with ANY controller, if it's Vestax, Akai, Native Instruments... You will always need to go back to the keyboard and mouse to get into the details. That's one thing I've realised after purchasing MANY controllers in my time, there is no holy grail, there is nothing that will be perfect, so cut it down to what is it you really want. The Vestax, for me, is a sketch pad controller for my productions, something fun to mess with if I have a producer mate round, and it is a great performance controller (though a little heavy).

I've been looking at those ClyphX clip scripts to make this Vestax really shine...
http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=153113

I feel you man -- going back to the keyboard and mouse is inevitable-- unless you get a mixing board which would require me selling my shoes and tv and car etc etc
the cool feature in the vestax is the band button which lets you have access to 12 audio channels.
thanks for the info man --- appreciate it

[moreofmorris]

I purchased my Vestax VCM 600 about six months ago.

I personally love it. I think it's a great piece of kit. Built like brick shit house and is clearly laid out. It's definitely more a sketch pad controller when it comes to producing with it. I almost always start off most of my tunes by using it. You can quickly build up a small 6 channel set with your ideas, and rock with them pretty quickly. But I always find with ANY controller, if it's Vestax, Akai, Native Instruments... You will always need to go back to the keyboard and mouse to get into the details. That's one thing I've realised after purchasing MANY controllers in my time, there is no holy grail, there is nothing that will be perfect, so cut it down to what is it you really want. The Vestax, for me, is a sketch pad controller for my productions, something fun to mess with if I have a producer mate round, and it is a great performance controller (though a little heavy).

I've been looking at those ClyphX clip scripts to make this Vestax really shine...
http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=153113

I feel you man -- going back to the keyboard and mouse is inevitable-- unless you get a mixing board which would require me selling my shoes and tv and car etc etc
the cool feature in the vestax is the band button which lets you have access to 12 audio channels.
thanks for the info man --- appreciate it

The 12 channels is cool. But I rarely use it... Only because you're never quite sure where everything is. For example, you have all your first 6 channels setup, then you go to the next bank - but because everything is positioned for the first 6 tracks, you have to move everything to adjust tracks 7-12. Then you go back to your first 6 channels again and it will need need repositioning again. If you know what I mean?

It's nice that it's there though...

...it's a tough one when it comes to all these controllers. I've become quite a minimalist after all these years of buying stuff. The only real way to go is to have something totally dynamic - like an iPad mixer or something, which would have endless faders/knobs etc. - but then you don't get the tactile touch of a decent knob (pardon my french).

For a sketch pad controller and for a performance controller for Live, it's pretty damn good though!

[yush]

I purchased my Vestax VCM 600 about six months ago.

I personally love it. I think it's a great piece of kit. Built like brick shit house and is clearly laid out. It's definitely more a sketch pad controller when it comes to producing with it. I almost always start off most of my tunes by using it. You can quickly build up a small 6 channel set with your ideas, and rock with them pretty quickly. But I always find with ANY controller, if it's Vestax, Akai, Native Instruments... You will always need to go back to the keyboard and mouse to get into the details. That's one thing I've realised after purchasing MANY controllers in my time, there is no holy grail, there is nothing that will be perfect, so cut it down to what is it you really want. The Vestax, for me, is a sketch pad controller for my productions, something fun to mess with if I have a producer mate round, and it is a great performance controller (though a little heavy).

I've been looking at those ClyphX clip scripts to make this Vestax really shine...
http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=153113

Oh yeah man - I get it --- you have to reassign midi controls every time you switch bands---- that sucks
I feel you man -- going back to the keyboard and mouse is inevitable-- unless you get a mixing board which would require me selling my shoes and tv and car etc etc
the cool feature in the vestax is the band button which lets you have access to 12 audio channels.
thanks for the info man --- appreciate it

The 12 channels is cool. But I rarely use it... Only because you're never quite sure where everything is. For example, you have all your first 6 channels setup, then you go to the next bank - but because everything is positioned for the first 6 tracks, you have to move everything to adjust tracks 7-12. Then you go back to your first 6 channels again and it will need need repositioning again. If you know what I mean?

It's nice that it's there though...

...it's a tough one when it comes to all these controllers. I've become quite a minimalist after all these years of buying stuff. The only real way to go is to have something totally dynamic - like an iPad mixer or something, which would have endless faders/knobs etc. - but then you don't get the tactile touch of a decent knob (pardon my french).

For a sketch pad controller and for a performance controller for Live, it's pretty damn good though!

[dj-eldy]

I have had the VCM600 now for 8 months. It is definately worth the money!! It is totally customisable and will have more than enough capability for anyone using it. It has instant mapping in Live, although I have found that it is better to map all the functions manually as not all the controller's buttons illuminate unless you have assigned them manually.

I have used it for live djing at events for a while and the size of the controller is a slight concern. Most dj booths are not designed for the space needed. I have had a custom made flight case built for it, which does take up a lot of room so you will need to bare this in mind if you intend on using it at live shows/gigs.

I have tried a few other controllers prior to purchasing the VCM600, and to be honest, nothing comes close. The build quality and flexibility it gives you is second to none in this controller market and made my old novation and m-audio units look and feel like childrens toy in comparison!!

Another issue that may concern is that support in the UK from Vestax is for a want of a better word - SHIT!! So if you ever encounter any problems with your unit or pc when using the VCM600, the forums are your only answer.

To me, this is a must buy, especially for "live" Live users. I think though, that maybe Vestax think about making a baby brother for it. Say a 3 or 4 channel version with fewer controls as not everyone will need such a comprehensive unit for live situations.

[Forge.]

To me, this is a must buy, especially for "live" Live users. I think though, that maybe Vestax think about making a baby brother for it. Say a 3 or 4 channel version with fewer controls as not everyone will need such a comprehensive unit for live situations.

funny enough I sent them an email requesting this! (and they replied!) - I would like just a VCM200 that has 2 channels but a bank button so you can go to 4 if you need to.. that would be perfect for straight DJing

[Forge.]

The 12 channels is cool. But I rarely use it... Only because you're never quite sure where everything is. For example, you have all your first 6 channels setup, then you go to the next bank - but because everything is positioned for the first 6 tracks, you have to move everything to adjust tracks 7-12. Then you go back to your first 6 channels again and it will need need repositioning again. If you know what I mean?

It's nice that it's there though...

what I did there for a while was had the first 6 set up with DJ tracks on the first 2 or 3 tracks, then some tracks for loops, then track 6 was a drum track, then when you press the bank button you can control the individual elements of the drum track, i.e. track 1 kick, track 2 hats, 3 = clap, 4= snare, 5,6 toms/percussion - that way it was always dead easy to see the difference between the 2 banks - when the bank button was lit up red it meant I was controlling the individual drums

also what I did was switch to using the 3 EQ knobs + kill switches to just being volume controls for each 707, 808 and 909 drums for each of these channels. So instead of triggering the different drums with different clips, I just had one clip hard wired to the play buttons on tracks 7-12 that had notes for all 3 in them and then decide if they are heard with the volume(eq) knobs and kill switches. This way I had a lot more control over the drum track ad could layer drum sounds etc.

I could still control EQ etc on the full drum track on track 6 so it would be more or less another loop

But I totally agree with what you said - this is more like a sketchpad - and this particular sketchpad ended up just creating more work in the end once I started trying to fine tune all the automation etc with keyboard/mouse.

to be totally honest I spent a lot of time working on big fancy template sets so that I could do big clever live sets on the fly and I never felt satisfied. I just always came to the conclusion that people in general will have a better night when you just play good tunes where they are already well produced and carry the vibe than me standing there on stage playing the hunched nerd being all clever but spending 10 minutes fucking around with a drum track so that I'm the only one that knows I'm tweaking the hi-hat and to everyone else it doesn't sound much different ....etc - to me this is the great dilemma of trying to do electronic music live... much harder to strike that balance between clever and interesting, and good to dance to.

Frankly, just playing 2 good tracks together is much more likely to get a room rocking IMO.

[/2c]