ABLETON SHOULD MAKE A STRICLY DJ MODE

[3phase]

+1

The only reason you need to see multiple waveforms when djing is when you are trying to beatmatch visually (which you shouldn't really need if you actually know what you are doing), and since you don't need to beatmatch with live, this is completely unnecessary. I would recommend actually listening to your tracks to figure out where the breakdowns and such are, rather than relying on visual information. 3phase is on point as usual.

No, 3phase is wrong as usual. I DJ'd with vinyl for ~10 years,

oh..10 years... thast a hell lot of time... and we have seen allmost no real development of live... the just start now to do it all at once instead cutting time..

However..i dont see why you need multiple waveform displays at once..that is the point.. its all the time possible to look into the waveform of the playing clip... on records you cant watch the tracks of two records simultaniously either...
When you oppose to that please make a youtube video and show us..must look funny..


However what is missing here is relaiv navigation commands in live.. so navigations that are relativ to clips or scenes playimg..or selcted tracks..

and in regard of the waveform a command that selects the running clip waveform display and automatical activates follow..

that would help to get quicker acces.. but in general you also just can selct the clip yourself..as a dj with 10 years experiance you should know which clip is on wright now

[docprosper]

Don't get me wrong everybody; I'm a mere amateur and 3phase is obviously better and smarter than me in every way. Sure I don't need to see both waveforms at once, but preferably i would not have to hit buttons on my controllers to switch views between tracks. Is this not easy to grasp?

Ten years is not that much time in the bigger picture, but it is enough time to understand what I could use out of my software.

[beats me]

HP should make a Mac.

[3phase]

Don't get me wrong everybody; I'm a mere amateur and 3phase is obviously better and smarter than me in every way. Sure I don't need to see both waveforms at once, but preferably i would not have to hit buttons on my controllers to switch views between tracks. Is this not easy to grasp?

Ten years is not that much time in the bigger picture, but it is enough time to understand what I could use out of my software.

sure 10 years are enough but when you seeso clearly that you need optical gimicks insead programing a single button to just show you the desired waveform you defently should choose a dedicated dj software. instead asking for a total rewrite of the guy..

you was the one that said that i am allways wrong.. but you know.. a single button press is too much work for you but juggeling with 2 vinyls and 2 hardware record players is ok and easy..

Isnt it rather that you have seen the nice waveform displays on dedicated dj software and got greedy to have such features aswell? just for the looks?

thats all reasons why we shouldnt have a special dj mode.. the program is allready geared to much towards blinking fx and impressing beginners instead suporting proffesional productiv workflows..

please no more blender features.. maybe buy some chrome spoilers for your laptop?

[docprosper]

Sorry to disappoint you; I've never looked at other sw for djing. Got into ableton for production and then started djing with it. I have no interest in going to another program for one of the two functions as live is pretty conducive to both. I'm not lazy, I've got better things to do with my buttons and fingers.

Do you just troll threads about feature requests and bitch about the current product? Is this your hobby?

[3phase]

Sorry to disappoint you; I've never looked at other sw for djing. Got into ableton for production and then started djing with it. I have no interest in going to another program for one of the two functions as live is pretty conducive to both. I'm not lazy, I've got better things to do with my buttons and fingers.

Do you just troll threads about feature requests and bitch about the current product? Is this your hobby?

i have made in this thread more constructive suggestions to help you dickhead dj´s without restructuring the whole program than all of you guys together..

You are just able to moan about not having your two or more waveform displays and totally ignore the given structure with that...

When you have better things to do with your buttons and fingers maybe do that, and leave the djíng to somebody else?

[docprosper]

You win... You're so smart. And helpful. Congratulations.

[3phase]

You win... You're so smart. And helpful. Congratulations.

ohh... dont cry.. with a bit practize you will made it.. you can do it.. just dont watch your hands

[rsaulo]

on records you cant watch the tracks of two records simultaniously either...

Oh, Really??? I always had to be able to see the 2 decks, so watching two records simultaniously... Even if I had only one eye.

that would help to get quicker acces.. but in general you also just can selct the clip yourself

Fair enought, I can do that, and I DO THAT today, mapping the selections of tracks to controller buttons to select the desired track and show the playing clip waveform, but sometimes I get the effects view instead of the waveform view and need to hit <shift + tab> to change to effects view. BTW, I need to discover how to select the playing clip of a track AND go to waveform view too, maybe you can help me on this.

BUT, this is all workarounds, that word that you write against in every f$%@*& thread on this forum and now you tell me to DO NOT REQUEST the feature and DO A WORKAROUND??? Come on... Be consistent...

[3phase]

on records you cant watch the tracks of two records simultaniously either...

Oh, Really??? I always had to be able to see the 2 decks, so watching two records simultaniously... Even if I had only one eye.

[

the tracks of the two records...or better the grooves... so that you can see what is going on and see breaks coming up..please show me how you do that on two record players ..


dj hammerhead?



and workaround for dj´s are ok.. work arounds for live musicans not..they dont have so much time on stage as a dj and often not even a hand free..

And for a 10 years old so called daw workarounds only for exotic szenarios please

[3phase]

but sometimes I get the effects view instead of the waveform view and need to hit <shift + tab> to change to effects view. BTW, I need to discover how to select the playing clip of a track AND go to waveform view too, maybe you can help me on this.

Ableton should help us on this because thats also interesting for live acts.. and this with program internal functions and not with the aid of max..

meta buttons that fx just the devices on the selected track as in the apc 40-.. but also for non apc users..as part of the program.. no max for live necessary..

And with that a button that recalls the waveform display of the clip Playing..or one that toggles the waveform displays of the active clips..

on that shows and focuses on screen the playing clip maybe .. there are so many possible usefull meta remote functions that one needs to select the ones with the most positve workflow impact for all.. And that there are so many shows that this area is underdeveloped..we actually only have the selcted scene launch as a meta remote function..and the clip transpose and level..teire assignment works on any selcted clip.. But actually we would need much more of this kind of functionality..

That of cause needs some deeper thinking than a quick forum post but dj´s and live acts would benefit from a few more overview and navigation related meta buttons they can adress with theire remotes or laptop keyboard

I yesterday saw a little i phone app that was better suited for djing than ableton live

[rsaulo]

and workaround for dj´s are ok.. work arounds for live musicans not..they dont have so much time on stage as a dj and often not even a hand free..

So, I suppose that workarounds to producers are OK too right?

Ableton should help us on this because thats also interesting for live acts.. and this with program internal functions and not with the aid of max..

meta buttons that fx just the devices on the selected track as in the apc 40-.. but also for non apc users..as part of the program.. no max for live necessary..

And with that a button that recalls the waveform display of the clip Playing..or one that toggles the waveform displays of the active clips..

on that shows and focuses on screen the playing clip maybe .. there are so many possible usefull meta remote functions that one needs to select the ones with the most positve workflow impact for all.. And that there are so many shows that this area is underdeveloped..we actually only have the selcted scene launch as a meta remote function..and the clip transpose and level..teire assignment works on any selcted clip.. But actually we would need much more of this kind of functionality..

That of cause needs some deeper thinking than a quick forum post but dj´s and live acts would benefit from a few more overview and navigation related meta buttons they can adress with theire remotes or laptop keyboard

Agree on all this.

[3phase]

and workaround for dj´s are ok.. work arounds for live musicans not..they dont have so much time on stage as a dj and often not even a hand free..

So, I suppose that workarounds to producers are OK too right?

not really after 10 years of development... and not when you call the product a daw..

ableton themself dont really sell the program as dj software..really cant understand that they brake their promisses and quality statement for this serato scratch stunt.. rather odd that the program learns first to sync to a timecode record befor it really works with other musicans or general timecode..

btw.. question to the dj´s.. is this serato timecode vinyl syncing working now? i ask to find out wether ableton is able to write propper sync algos when they want... In the moment it rather appears a bit as beeing unableton than as just paying no attention.
A propper working seraro sync would suggest the opposite..

[henke]

So if Ableton alone for DJing isn't ideal, why the hell is Serato+The Bridge now what you need?

this whole notion which has dominated the thread since henke posted overlooks the fact that henke is an employee of Ableton, he's not the entire staff. it seems that he's free to state his opinions on Live as he sees it which can change over time. he's the same guy that once stated "a vocoder? that's retarded, nobody needs a vocoder! <chuckle>" and now we have a vocoder.

(apologies to henke if this makes him feel over analyzed.)

Overa nalysed. I can deal with that.

Serato+The Bridge is no contradiction to what i said; it means that Live itself does not need to offer the perfect solution for classical DJing, since it is possible to connect it in a meaningful way with Serato. That's the whole point of the story.

As far as all those: "You guys just have to add (insert feature X here ) requests" are concerned: They all might seem simple and most obvious things to do. But what will Live become if we add all of those? A monster with millions of options, page of pages of preferences, gigantic menus to scroll thru etc. Implementing features is easy. Avoiding to add too much is complicated. Every single thing we implement has to stay in this software for ever. I spend a lot of time watching other users. Every single button on the interface is a potential problem and confuses users. The software is supposed to be simple and powerful at the same time and this is extremely hard to achieve. Not just for Ableton, it's a big problem for every software product.

Robert

[docprosper]

As far as all those: "You guys just have to add (insert feature X here ) requests" are concerned: They all might seem simple and most obvious things to do. But what will Live become if we add all of those? A monster with millions of options, page of pages of preferences, gigantic menus to scroll thru etc. Implementing features is easy. Avoiding to add too much is complicated. Every single thing we implement has to stay in this software for ever. I spend a lot of time watching other users. Every single button on the interface is a potential problem and confuses users. The software is supposed to be simple and powerful at the same time and this is extremely hard to achieve. Not just for Ableton, it's a big problem for every software product.

Robert

I couldn't agree more, and I think splitting the product into two modes (or products) would only exacerbate the problem. I do, however, wish there was a M4L solution to the multiple waveform view request, which seems to be a fairly popular request from the DJs on the forum. If this was implimentable in M4L (without having to load audio clips directly into M4L to do so...) then it could be a feature for those of us desperate enough to create a device to do it without crippling the program as a "core" feature.
-Hamish