Does live have an input limiter?

[td6d]

Could anyone tell me how I can limit incoming signal?
I've got my Zoom H2 recorder hooked up through USB with the mic gain low but even at half the input signal it clips hárd in live. All the limiters etc just work post input. The tracks volume/gain doesn't do anything to it either.

[td6d]

No? Nobody?

[crumhorn]

The best bet when recording an unpredictable performance is to set Live to record 24 bit files and then work at around -12 or even -18 db. This will give you plenty of margin for unexpected loud events and still give you better than CD sound quality.

[oblique strategies]

but TBH - unless its a very very good quality compressor/limiter that is also well setsup for the material, you will get a much better result to work with simply by turning the level down.

I am about to digitize a lot of cassette tapes, some with highly unpredictable levels. I have an Aphex Dominator II Model 720 Multiband Limiter that I intend to use for the more troublesome tapes. I have heard from a number of reliable sources that this is indeed a good limiter. Do you agree?

[3dot...]

tape = line level mostly..
I don't see the problem..

just record it with -6db peaks and normalize later

generally recording with a limiter isn't a good idea..
especially if your source is predictable.
.(like a tape and other playback devices which have a set maximum volume)

check the gain settings of your audio device..
it should have a +4/-10/inst. switch ...
that switch should get you in the ballpark..
no matter what source you're recording

[3dot...]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_level

[oblique strategies]

tape = line level mostly..
I don't see the problem..

just record it with -6db peaks and normalize later

generally recording with a limiter isn't a good idea..
especially if your source is predictable.
.(like a tape and other playback devices which have a set maximum volume)

Understood. However, the problem is wildly unpredictable levels & hundreds of cassettes. Time is the issue here: I don't have time to preview every tape all the way through listening for the peaks. For some tapes I'll do this, but not for all, there's just too many. Plus they are old & the more I play them the more risk I take.

My thought was to set a brick wall limiter so that no clipping can occur, & do a simple peak test by previewing a few places on each tape.

[crumhorn]

Just leave a large margin for error and all will be fine, cassettes are fairly heavily compressed anyway, 60dB dynamic range maximum.

Find - or record - a tape that peaks out the VU meters on the cassette deck and set your 0dB level to that.

Then let Live or your favourite wave editor normalise the recordings.

Any additional compression or noise reduction should be done in the digital domain.

That's what I'd do.

[oblique strategies]

Some of the levels on the cassettes are so low that I intend to go through a mixer to boost the signal.

Some years ago I digitized a bunch of 8-track cassettes by patching from the tape deck outputs directly into Pro Tools inputs, & some of the resultant files are just too low. So I'm thinking that I'll try for a better signal to noise ratio for this round of tape work.

[chapelier fou]

Sorry to say that, but read how an audio chain works.
Adjusting input gains is the first thing to do when you record something.

[3dot...]

but theres really no need for a limiter... a tape deck has line output...
and so the volume will never go over a certain thresh...
theres no need for compression before the input ..

sure you can do it.. but unless you have an ultra precise limiter envelope..
you run the risk of changing the dynamics of your source..
why not just adjust the gain slightly
you need to do it once for the deck.. not for every cassette

a limiter on the input might be good for very dynamic vocalist or acoustic source...where the volume is unpredictable

[oblique strategies]

Sorry to say that, but read how an audio chain works.
Adjusting input gains is the first thing to do when you record something.

But of course, my friend. I have been recording for decades, & am quite familiar with the process.

What I am unexperienced with is using a stand alone hardware limiter, & am looking for tips on how to use one. I am also trying to streamline the process for recording approximately 500+ cassettes.

a limiter on the input might be good for very dynamic vocalist or acoustic source...where the volume is unpredictable

Your last sentence is precisely making my point: I have cassettes that have widely varying dynamic levels -from a whisper to a scream. Hence the notion of using a limiter for these cassettes.

I certainly hope that I do not need to use a limiter, but I don't want to find clipping at the end of a 90 minute recording! There are just too many cassettes & not enough time for that!

[3dot...]

ok..
so you understand that if the output of your cassette when set to unity( 0db)..
and the correct input mode selected on your audio device..
then the tape shouldn't come in too hot (ever)

btw
I do a lot of conversions..
(Ive done literally thousands . I do restoration and re masters)

what we did for speeding things up...
we had the tape decks modded..by an electronics dude
so that we playback at x12 times faster
and the tape head plays both sides at once (one in reverse)
each side to a seperate audio input...
(8 decks at once =16 inputs ..no compression applied)

into Live..
I then procede to timestretch /12 and ' reverse' side b..
normalizing and cleaning too are all inside the computer..
it just makes more sense..

[chapelier fou]

Sorry to say that, but read how an audio chain works.
Adjusting input gains is the first thing to do when you record something.

But of course, my friend. I have been recording for decades, & am quite familiar with the process.

What I am unexperienced with is using a stand alone hardware limiter, & am looking for tips on how to use one. I am also trying to streamline the process for recording approximately 500+ cassettes.

(I was just quickly answering to the original poster)

[crumhorn]

...
I then procede to timestretch /12
...

But......

If your sound card input as a frequency range of 20 Hz to 20 Khz (as is normal) then you will be limiting the maximum frequency to 20 divided by 12 = approx 1.7Khz, which isn't even telephone bandwidth. Even at the maximum theoretical bandwidth and a sample rate of 192Kbps you would still be limited to 8Khz.

How are you getting these 12 * samples into your computer?