Buying A Controller

Syncretia · Post by **Syncretia** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:42 am

I also want to buy a controller for Ableton. Some options are the APC40, Maschine (software + controller), or a completely generic controller. I'm thinking about the Akai MPD32. I'm probably on the wrong forum because people are probably going to usher me toward the Ableton product here.

To start this thread off, I'm trying to limit the amount of redundant hardware. I already have an Axiom 25 which is pretty good for recording drums because the pads are velocity controlled. So, I don't want another controller for the purpose of being a drum instrument. I want a controller which can be used as a step sequencer, and an Ableton clip controller.

What real advantage does the APC40 offer when in theory a generic controller should do the same job? Can't I map Ableton's controls to midi knobs etc. anyway? I will be using other software, so why would I buy a controller that will be limited to Ableton? Can this controller be used inside other software? E.g. Reaktor, or Logic Studio?

Can the Maschine controller be used for non-Maschine stuff like controlling Ableton? Can something like the MPD32 control clips in Ableton?

Lastly, does Ableton have support for generic midi step sequencers?

3dot... · Post by **3dot...** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:58 am

+ this to you Axiom and you're good..

3dot... · Post by **3dot...** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 2:02 am

btw...
LaunchPad APC40 Maschine can be used in any other midi capable software

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jv6MXhz7L4

Syncretia · Post by **Syncretia** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 2:19 am

Yeah, when I said "generic", I assumed there was such a thing as "generic". It seems all the hardware manufacturers align themselves with a software package. When I say "all the hardware manufacturers", I guess I am really talking about Akai, NI and Novation. I guess the only real question is how many of the LED pads do I need?

Would I be right in saying that step sequencers work on an X,Y grid: X representing time and Y representing different sounds? So, If want finer granularity in step sequencing, I need more buttons on the X axis right? I mean if the beat is 4/4 and I want to play one note on every beat, I need 4 going across right? If I want a not on every half beat, I need 8 going across right? Is that how step sequencing works?

3dot... · Post by **3dot...** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 2:36 am

step sequencing (when done right..)
should be able to let you insert beats at a minimum of 1/16 resolution...
if you have a 4 bar loop... and want 1 octave...(semitones)
you'd need 64 buttons diagonal..
and 12 vertical..
that's quite a monster..
with an 8x8 (launchpad) controller you page through the bars..
there are different launchpad step sequencers available..each does it a bit different..
generally speaking the more buttons the better !!

Syncretia · Post by **Syncretia** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 5:22 am

Right, so that's definitely a thumbs up for the Launchpad and APC40 because they both have 8x8 pads whereas the maschine controller only has 4x4. Can I use the APC40 inside Maschine? Is there anything that I won't be able to do inside Maschine that I could do with the real Maschine controller?

PS: Where do get the thing above? While we're on the topic of out of the ordinary midi controllers - does anyone know they name of the device that is like a long keyboard but is a kind of ribbon? Amon Tobin used it on ISAM. You can see a demo of it on his website.

Edit: Turns out it's called a Haken Continuum. And, at the price of $5000 I will definitely be buying one... In about ten years.

Cezband · Post by **Cezband** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 9:28 am

Can't answer with too much depth on the other questions, but that huge gridded beast is a monome - it's like a home-brew, massively customisable, rather complicated midi-controller. There's a few different versions with various sized grids, and you'll find that both the APC40 and Launchpad have Monome emulators available to make them behave more like one. They're pretty horribly expensive though, and I understand that you need some pretty decent programming chops to get the best out of them.

Oh, also - I love my launchpad, one of the best value purchases I've made. Between using the clip launching grid and switching to mixer mode for things like arming and soloing (not so much for volume, panning etc) it gets you a whole lot closer to mouse-free operation. You can also use the user 1 mode to play a second synth and sometimes it's refreshing to try to write a melody on a grid instead of a keyboard.

RedGit · Post by **RedGit** » Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:06 pm

Hello!

I would love to use the KORG nanoPad together with Ableton Live.
I´ve installed the latest Driver, but I´m only able to use the
big Pad (sort of Chaos-Pad), and not the nummerized Pads 1 to 12.

That´s a big problem for me, because as a Guitarist, playing also
in a JazzBand using Loops etc, I would like to controll
Ableton Live with my feet.

Any Ideas?
I could need some Help!
Thanks a Lot!

Syncretia · Post by **Syncretia** » Tue Jul 12, 2011 12:34 am

I'm actually starting to wonder if Maschine is worth it. It does seem to have largest array of drumkits, and does seem to have a good sequencer. But, the controller is only 4x4 and not velocity sensitive (neither is the APC40 btw). But, at the end of the day, how much better is Maschine's drum sequencer than Ableton's? I'm starting to think that people overate Maschine as an instrument just because it has the best sounds and some already made loops. You could easily import all the sounds in to Simpler and sequence inside Ableton.

Just a thought. I'm leaning toward the APC40 btw.

Dragonbreath · Post by **Dragonbreath** » Tue Jul 12, 2011 1:41 am

I would sugggest the apc

Hans has a remote script that enables the apc as a step sequence (amongst other things)
http://remotescripts.blogspot.com/p/apc-64-40.html

It automaps everything in ableton (well almost...)

It could be more usefull with programs like logic because it has faders and knobs too

I love its the best controller ever...lol

bigbadotis · Post by **bigbadotis** » Tue Jul 12, 2011 1:58 am

Kruddler wrote:Right, so that's definitely a thumbs up for the Launchpad and APC40 because they both have 8x8 pads whereas the maschine controller only has 4x4. Can I use the APC40 inside Maschine? Is there anything that I won't be able to do inside Maschine that I could do with the real Maschine controller?

PS: Where do get the thing above? While we're on the topic of out of the ordinary midi controllers - does anyone know they name of the device that is like a long keyboard but is a kind of ribbon? Amon Tobin used it on ISAM. You can see a demo of it on his website.

Edit: Turns out it's called a Haken Continuum. And, at the price of $5000 I will definitely be buying one... In about ten years.

There's a user-contributed emulation that comes with Control if you're interested in getting an iPad or an Android tablet... works pretty well.

Here's a demo (involving a wall of modular synths):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uWTTby2 ... r_embedded

Wall of synths:
http://pellegriniusa.com/js/synths.jpg

starving student · Post by **starving student** » Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:04 am

Kruddler wrote:I'm actually starting to wonder if Maschine is worth it. It does seem to have largest array of drumkits, and does seem to have a good sequencer. But, the controller is only 4x4 and not velocity sensitive (neither is the APC40 btw). But, at the end of the day, how much better is Maschine's drum sequencer than Ableton's? I'm starting to think that people overate Maschine as an instrument just because it has the best sounds and some already made loops. You could easily import all the sounds in to Simpler and sequence inside Ableton.

Just a thought. I'm leaning toward the APC40 btw.

why do you keep saying maschine is not velocity sensitive, it's the most expressive controller on the market right now.

also you could do allot better than your axiom, try out any fatar controller and you won't want to use your axiom any more.

also the reason why people are looking at all these different controllers is because they're different and become different instruments when combined with a computer, there's nothing generic about musical instrumentation.

starving student · Post by **starving student** » Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:06 am

one more thing, most maschine users absolutely did not buy maschine because of the sound library, most are not unlike myself, I don't even use it. there are some for whom it has value though, but from the jump it's never even been a selling point for me.

Dragonbreath · Post by **Dragonbreath** » Tue Jul 12, 2011 11:01 pm

starving student wrote:
Kruddler wrote:I'm actually starting to wonder if Maschine is worth it. It does seem to have largest array of drumkits, and does seem to have a good sequencer. But, the controller is only 4x4 and not velocity sensitive (neither is the APC40 btw). But, at the end of the day, how much better is Maschine's drum sequencer than Ableton's? I'm starting to think that people overate Maschine as an instrument just because it has the best sounds and some already made loops. You could easily import all the sounds in to Simpler and sequence inside Ableton.

Just a thought. I'm leaning toward the APC40 btw.
why do you keep saying maschine is not velocity sensitive, it's the most expressive controller on the market right now.

also you could do allot better than your axiom, try out any fatar controller and you won't want to use your axiom any more.

also the reason why people are looking at all these different controllers is because they're different and become different instruments when combined with a computer, there's nothing generic about musical instrumentation.

I dont like the axiom very much. My friend has one and overall Id stay with my mpk49 over it anyday...
But have you ever tried the pads on an axiom? They are VERY responsive, almost too much in a way
I have the mpk49 and a trigger finger from m-audio and neiter comes close the sensitivity on the axiom

starving student · Post by **starving student** » Wed Jul 13, 2011 2:19 am

yes I've actually had an axiom in the past and they are more sensitive than the triggerfinger I've had one of those too, but it doesn't come close to the maschine or the korg padkontrol for that matter which I've used also. I would go for an akai mpk over an axiom any day.
but i have no idea why dude is spreading misinformation about the most basic things about maschine.
strange post.

Buying A Controller

Buying A Controller

Re: Buying A Controller

Re: Buying A Controller

Re: Buying A Controller

Re: Buying A Controller

Re: Buying A Controller

Re: Buying A Controller

KORG nanoPad

Re: Buying A Controller

Re: Buying A Controller

Re: Buying A Controller

Re: Buying A Controller

Re: Buying A Controller

Re: Buying A Controller

Re: Buying A Controller