Why did Native Instruments stop producing Kore 2,

[glitchrock-buddha]

so how much of a hit do you take for this functionality and I'm asking while understanding that if you mute something you reap those resources back, but is the consensus that it's easy on most peoples systems or is it too hungry?

But that depends on what you load into it. The more plug-ins you load, the more cpu heavy it will be. But that's just like asking what a given DAW is like on cpu. It depends how much you load into it. Kore itself uses almost nothing when empty.

[humnumb]

I have seen it posted on news sites, it seems weird that they would stop producing Kore all of a sudden, and all of the expansion packs available for it, and the Kore Player.

Actually, NI is selling the Kore expansion packs again until the end of the month for a reduced price, as well as giving away 3 free packs to Kore owners. Kore Player is still available as a backup download from the NI site.

The stories say that it is because they want to concentrate on Maschine, but to me they seem like two different products that are meant for different groups of customers.

It's not some rumored news story. NI has been pretty clear on this. They're offering a crossgrade discount on Maschine for Kore users because it will be the only thing in their product line in terms of the integrated host concept:

"Development resources will be refocused from Kore to Maschine and its popular instrument hosting features. Maschine will be enhanced with specific preset management and parameter mapping features for Komplete and individual NI instruments in the upcoming free 1.7 update, and will be further expanded in its role as the central NI instruments host in the future.

Owners of the full versions of Kore 1 or Kore 2 (excluding software-only versions) who are interested in Maschine can purchase a special crossgrade price of $449 / €399 until the end of the year."
http://www.native-instruments.com/forum ... .php?f=124

"As Maschine has developed into a host for NI instruments due to popular demand from its already very sizable userbase, the feature set and purpose of Maschine and Kore would have been bound to overlap more and more in the future. In order not to create redundancy, but rather invest all resources into one single host system and expand it as efficiently as possible, the decision was ultimately made to focus future development resources to Maschine.

Obviously we do not expect Kore fans to be happy about this announcement, but we hope that the upcoming maintenance updates, including the 64bit features, as well as the crossgrade offer to Maschine combined with its expanding instrument hosting features, will accommodate as many Kore users as much as possible."
http://www.native-instruments.com/forum ... ostcount=1

"There are plans to further expand instrument hosting and sound management functions in Maschine and some of these might be similar to certain features in Kore. There will be more information on this in the future.

The integration concept remains. Actually, the fact that Kore's technical approach to integration cannot be maintained with feasible effort was the most important reason to discontinue its development. Maschine will grow into integrating the products of Komplete, like Kore did, yet in a different and sustainable way.

Maschine 1.7 will add browsing and direct loading of sounds from all NI instruments directly within the Maschine browser as well as pre-mapped sound parameters. Future versions of Maschine will likely add more features along those lines and we'll pass on more details as soon as we can.

All Maschine owners will really benefit from the new focus in terms of development resources.

Maschine is a central part of our product line-up and has a comprehensive road map ahead of it."

[Machinesworking]

It's not some rumored news story. NI has been pretty clear on this. They're offering a crossgrade discount on Maschine for Kore users because it will be the only thing in their product line in terms of the integrated host concept:

[snip]
They've said all that for sure, but here's another NI guy saying the opposite of some of those quotes.

As there is a lot of discussion about Maschine, I'd like to point out that the crossgrade is just a courtesy offer and Maschine should not be seen as a replacement or direct successor of Kore. Regarding the upcoming version 1.7, it will essentially make it possible to browse and launch presets of NI instruments directly from the Maschine browser, but it won't emulate the more specific sound design and database features of Kore.

They buried this in a 1500+ post thread, annoying that it's an official word, but not done in an official way. They of course can do what they want, but don't for a minute think that a really great evolved MPC clone can replace Kore, and the insinuation is there, just like you pointed out with your quotes.

[delicioso]

It's not some rumored news story. NI has been pretty clear on this. They're offering a crossgrade discount on Maschine for Kore users because it will be the only thing in their product line in terms of the integrated host concept:

[snip]
They've said all that for sure, but here's another NI guy saying the opposite of some of those quotes.

As there is a lot of discussion about Maschine, I'd like to point out that the crossgrade is just a courtesy offer and Maschine should not be seen as a replacement or direct successor of Kore. Regarding the upcoming version 1.7, it will essentially make it possible to browse and launch presets of NI instruments directly from the Maschine browser, but it won't emulate the more specific sound design and database features of Kore.

They buried this in a 1500+ post thread, annoying that it's an official word, but not done in an official way. They of course can do what they want, but don't for a minute think that a really great evolved MPC clone can replace Kore, and the insinuation is there, just like you pointed out with your quotes.

The quote you bolded refers to the upcoming 1.7 update only.

[Machinesworking]

The quote you bolded refers to the upcoming 1.7 update only.

No it doesn't, read it again. Here's the relevant part to this...

I'd like to point out that the crossgrade is just a courtesy offer and Maschine should not be seen as a replacement or direct successor of Kore.

I'm not sure how you can take that as regarding the 1.7 update only, must have misread it.
The entire quote is here as well, nothing about it says that keir is referring to 1.7 only, he's very flatly saying that Maschine will not be a replacement for Kore, just that it will get Kore's development resources, big difference and worth noting. For me it means that unless I want Maschine for what Maschine is, I shouldn't buy it, and it would be unproductive and disappointing to think of it as an investment in a future Kore replacement. I don't know how you can read it as anything else unless you didn't catch this post by keir from NI.

[Anubis]

I think NI pulled the plug on this product prematurely. Kore was in a class of it's own. It was set up perfectly for instant tweak ability and the morph feature was priceless. It had a very intuitive interface that worked very well in Live. I think they made a huge miscalculation as is evident by the uproar.

[delicioso]

The quote you bolded refers to the upcoming 1.7 update only.

No it doesn't, read it again.

Yes it does, read it again. I'm referring to this sentence that you bolded the end part.

Regarding the upcoming version 1.7, it will essentially make it possible to browse and launch presets of NI instruments directly from the Maschine browser, but it won't emulate the more specific sound design and database features of Kore.

[Machinesworking]

I think NI pulled the plug on this product prematurely. Kore was in a class of it's own. It was set up perfectly for instant tweak ability and the morph feature was priceless. It had a very intuitive interface that worked very well in Live. I think they made a huge miscalculation as is evident by the uproar.

I think the initial drama in this thread points to the answer though, they never marketed it very well, only a small amount of people want a preset browser, but a performance oriented controller that switched sounds and knob/button assignments on the fly allowing the user to in my case stay in one Live Set and call up 16 odd instruments without taxing the CPU with instruments and FX that you're not using in that Scene is vastly useful.
I think a lot of people when Racks came out thought Racks can do what Kore does, but it's not really the case, and that again worked against Kore. In fact the fact that the most useful aspects of Kore really shine in Live was a negative, as NI and Live in the past have had some bugginess and drama, so selling Kore to the Live crowd was hard, when unfortunately that's the best audience for Kore.

[Machinesworking]

@delicioso this is getting tit for tat oriented without any real outcome, you didn't like Kore, you like Maschine, I remember that from the last time you started in with me on Kore.

You know that the entire quote flatly states that Maschine is not and will not become a replacement for Kore regardless of whether Maschine gets further updates past 1.7, so what are we arguing about?

[glitchrock-buddha]

I think NI pulled the plug on this product prematurely. Kore was in a class of it's own. It was set up perfectly for instant tweak ability and the morph feature was priceless. It had a very intuitive interface that worked very well in Live. I think they made a huge miscalculation as is evident by the uproar.

I think the initial drama in this thread points to the answer though, they never marketed it very well, only a small amount of people want a preset browser, but a performance oriented controller that switched sounds and knob/button assignments on the fly allowing the user to in my case stay in one Live Set and call up 16 odd instruments without taxing the CPU with instruments and FX that you're not using in that Scene is vastly useful.
I think a lot of people when Racks came out thought Racks can do what Kore does, but it's not really the case, and that again worked against Kore. In fact the fact that the most useful aspects of Kore really shine in Live was a negative, as NI and Live in the past have had some bugginess and drama, so selling Kore to the Live crowd was hard, when unfortunately that's the best audience for Kore.

I agree. Kore is the best thing that every happened to Live. The only reason I'm not fuming mad as most people are is because I don't need to Kore to eveolve anymore right now. As long as it keeps working, and they have said they'll maintain it and update to 64 bit. I still use other abandonned products from over 5 years ago like Spectral Delay, so assume Kore will be useable for quite some time. Sure there will be a day when Kore no longer works on my system, but realistically that is more than 5 years off probably and the entire computer music landscape will be totally different by then anyways. We'll all probably be using ipad/tablet DAWs and custom hybrid controllers that we've never dreamed of. Who knows, maybe will even realize they have to bring back something like Kore some day.

[Machinesworking]

I still use other abandonned products from over 5 years ago like Spectral Delay, so assume Kore will be useable for quite some time. Sure there will be a day when Kore no longer works on my system, but realistically that is more than 5 years off probably

Well one thing about that is that Spektral Delay, (my other wtf? moment with NI), has a lot less probability for issues than Kore does, so I'm really hoping you're right, but I'm willing to bet that anything you buy in the next couple years is very likely to have stability issues hosted in Kore, and upgrades/updates to plug ins also have that possibility. If I get 5 years out of Kore I'll be super happy, hell if it lasts three years without being broken by some plug in I'll be happy! considering I bet we're both still using Live at that point I'll drag up this thread to give you an interweb toast!

The most annoying thing will be troubleshooting crashes where tech support sees Kore in your Crash Log, and instantly blames "discontinued" Kore for the problem.... looking forward to the first time that happens.

[delicioso]

@delicioso this is getting tit for tat oriented without any real outcome, you didn't like Kore, you like Maschine, I remember that from the last time you started in with me on Kore.

You know that the entire quote flatly states that Maschine is not and will not become a replacement for Kore regardless of whether Maschine gets further updates past 1.7, so what are we arguing about?

I'm not sure what you're arguing about either. NI has clearly stated that "Maschine should not be seen as a replacement or direct successor of Kore" and that "Development resources will be refocused from Kore to Maschine and its popular instrument hosting features. Maschine will be enhanced with specific preset management and parameter mapping features for Komplete and individual NI instruments in the upcoming free 1.7 update, and will be further expanded in its role as the central NI instruments host in the future."

There's nothing contradictory about those statements. In fact, NI has stated clearly that Maschine will take a different and more sustainable approach:

"The integration concept remains. Actually, the fact that Kore's technical approach to integration cannot be maintained with feasible effort was the most important reason to discontinue its development. Maschine will grow into integrating the products of Komplete, like Kore did, yet in a different and sustainable way."

[beats me]

I think NI should discontinue this thread.

[Machinesworking]

I'm not sure what you're arguing about either. NI has clearly stated that "Maschine should not be seen as a replacement or direct successor of Kore"

Again, that statement isn't stated in the official statement, it's in the middle of a 1500+ post thread. Not arguing, I just think that's the clearest statement they made, and it's buried. Your insinuation was/is that they were clear, I do not agree, the insinuation at first was that Kore features would find themselves in Maschine which to a lot of people comes across as if Maschine is the direct successor of Kore. That might not have been their intention, but it's how it came across.

[doghouse]

NI has been restructuring it's business. There was a press release just before the Kore announcement:

Berlin, May 31th, 2011 – Native Instruments has just completed a major
share reorganization that makes the company entirely self-owned. The
reorganization was facilitated by CEO and founding shareholder Daniel
Haver, and comprises both a general shareholder consolidation and the
reacquisition of about 30% of the company’s shares from a long-standing
venture capital investor. Implemented in the month of Native
Instruments’ 15th anniversary, the consolidation effects complete
ownership of the company by its original founders and its executive
management team, and makes it independent from external investors.
„While this reorganization may sound like an abstract behind-the-scenes
process, the implications for our users and our industry are actually quite
profound“, says Daniel Haver. „As a completely self-owned enterprise, we
will now be able to pursue our vision for the most forward-thinking music
production and DJ technology in an even more energetic and
uncompromising fashion.“
With a revenue growth of 60% in 2009 and 70% in 2010, as well as
market-leading sales figures for its current product range centered around
MASCHINE, KOMPLETE and TRAKTOR, Native Instruments remains a
uniquely vital and dynamic company within the musical instruments
industry and the wider technology domain.

Kore was probably dropped because other products (like Maschine) had more growth potential. All companies have to decide when the investment in a particular product simply is not returning enough profit. At some point, they hit the wall with Kore.

The announcement just reminded me again of the limited lifespan of software products. Nothing prevents you from continuing to use Kore if you own it today but once NI comes out with new revs of their instruments you'll have to choose whether to stay up to date or stay with Kore.