Why does my music doesn't sounds as loud as other music?

[flowdesigner]

I'm with you on hardware, I have a largely hardware based setup (though I don't have the cash to get the really nice stuff).

you dont need the expensive stuff, for electronic music cheaper stuff sound cooler imo.
The expensive gear is to good/perfect - it almost gets like software again

Yeah true - I still love my Alesis 3630 for what it is

Daft punk use that on Homework

[Machinesworking]

Not much to add here, just that 95% of the time the electronic instruments in my tracks don't need compression, and the overall mix needs so little as to hardly be noticed.
Mostly live drums and vocals benefit from some limiting and compression in my experience, and like was mentioned or alluded to the main thing that helps out a tracks overall volume is raising and lowering the tracks volumes to let the other parts be heard, not compression and limiting.

I also seriously recommend that you at least get a few "disinterested third party" opinions if you're trying to mix and master your own music, objectivity is a bitch when you 'own' the sounds on disk. Plus ear fatigue is easier when you're that much more obsessed with getting it 'right'.

What's sad is upon investigating the loudness war how horribly this has affected live drums, though that's not much of an issue for most of you, it's brutal.

[Syncretia]

To be honest, I'm a bit confused by this flow of information...

Infinity - this has been a really confusing thread and has gone right off topic. You just wanted to know how to make your tracks louder but it drifted off in to the intricacies of mastering. Can I just give you the key points:

OK I obviously don't quite understand yet how normalization works...

Don't fear normalization. Some normalization engines might squash your mix but if you find that is happening, try a few different ones. If you open up your track in Audacity and normalise it, you will see exactly how it works as a wave image. It just makes the waves larger by a percentage. But, you don't have to use normalisation.

Compression

Feel free to use compression, but remember that if you use it on everything, you will get a squashed sound. It will enable you to turn up the master a bit though, or the normalisation will get more out of your mix. Remember, subtlety is the key with compression. Unless of course you want the squashed up sound.

Look For Unwanted Peaks!!!

I can't stress this enough. I tried to explain this at the start but I'll reiterate. Often, your music will suddenly have peaks without you realising. This causes clipping at that point and make your master track spike, or cause the normalisation engine to make your entire track quieter. You can just listen out for volume spikes, or you can use an audio editing tool like Audacity to see where the spikes are. You'd be surprised at where things are peaking.

EQ

As mentioned EQ'ing can also help. You can EQ spikes off a bit. Sometimes there might be spikes at the low or high end that are just plain unnecessary. Cut them out. Look up a tutorial on good EQ'ing.
PS: You don't have to use audacity, there are plenty of other good ones.

[The Carpet Cleaner]

I can do the mastering for your tracks for 20 euros each. It will be loud. There will still be some dynamics.

[juanpablo1313]

Ok, I know what's going on.

This has been a long time question, and yet no one seem to understand it. It happens that, in effect, ableton mixes are not loud enough when exported. And I know that response about mastering and etc, but that's not the problem. The fact is: it is quieter, in some cases, for some people. Google about it "not loud export ableton" or something like that. It's everywhere on the Internet and every1 says: "mastering". It's not that: it is a problem.

You know, I've been exporting on different sequencers, friend's houses and on my rig on ableton and sonar. I had that problem when I used ableton. Sometimes, for some people it seems, ABLETON IS NOT LOUD ENOUGH, WHEN COMPARING TO OTHER APPS. Shit, even "made on 5 minutes" tracks made on garageband sound louder. It is a fact and I hope that someone can upload a track made on ableton with the problem and another from the same computer made on cubase or whatever.

Trust me...

[The Carpet Cleaner]

Ok, I know what's going on.

This has been a long time question, and yet no one seem to understand it. It happens that, in effect, ableton mixes are not loud enough when exported. And I know that response about mastering and etc, but that's not the problem. The fact is: it is quieter, in some cases, for some people. Google about it "not loud export ableton" or something like that. It's everywhere on the Internet and every1 says: "mastering". It's not that: it is a problem.

You know, I've been exporting on different sequencers, friend's houses and on my rig on ableton and sonar. I had that problem when I used ableton. Sometimes, for some people it seems, ABLETON IS NOT LOUD ENOUGH, WHEN COMPARING TO OTHER APPS. Shit, even "made on 5 minutes" tracks made on garageband sound louder. It is a fact and I hope that someone can upload a track made on ableton with the problem and another from the same computer made on cubase or whatever.

Trust me...

Lol I made some tracks on ableton that are already as loud as other commercial songs.

[Syncretia]

Think of normalisation like resizing an image. When you open up an image in any image editing tool and you check the checkbox that says "Maintain Aspect Ratio", the width stays relative to the height. If you don't check that box, the image gets skewed. But, as long as that checkbox is ticked, no matter what size you change the image to, in will not be skewed.

Normalisation is the same thing. It just multiplies the volume until the highest peak is almost clipping. In other words, it just makes the song as loud as it can without changing the dynamics of the song. You still need to have a smooth mix beforehand for this to work well.

[The Carpet Cleaner]

Tarekith on this forum made me understand that normalization is pointless once you hit the ceiling of your limiter... That is so obvious to me now but it was not 1 year ago... I would use normalisation on loops or tracks that are not limited or that don't reach the ceiling of the limiter... But using a limiter is a better solution anyway so nowadays I never normalize anymore.

[ze2be]

Infinity, do hou have the Limiter plug in Live Intro?

In that case, this is how I do an eazy quick and loud mixdown:
-I keep all tracks peaking at max -8dB, and set all faders at zero dB. (some use -12 or -16)
By watching the tracks peak meter; a number in a small box above the faders,
you can quickly see spikes. Check if those spikes are often, or just now and then. If its often, try to fix it with eq and volume adjustments. If it has just a few spikes, put the limiter plug on the track, and set the treshold to push down the sporadic spikes only. Set the release envelope as short as possible, so that it masks out just the peak. You dont want it to be audiable! Also, some tracks like cymbals and shakes might have a sweat spot at say -16dB, while others fit well at -8dB. It that case, fix the peaks in those levels.

When you have done this on all tracks that needs it, you shold be able to get a much louder mix.

Good luck with the mixing

[Syncretia]

Good work. Sounds good.

Whatever you have done, you have made the track loud.

Another thing to remember about all this:

DONT DO YOUR OWN MASTERING!

If you want to know why, the video that was posted a few pages ago will explain why. Here it is again:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nlzwDfxVSg

Your mix sounds good to my ears, and probably most other people's ears. But good mastering can add just that little extra that you won't be able to do in Ableton alone without thousands of dollars of expensive equipment.

[InfinityUnit]

Thanks again every one for those advices.

1st- I'd like to ask this stupid question : If I can't trust my ears, what do I trust? My nose? While I'm new to DAWs and electronic music production, However I'm not to music... And while I was playing the French horn for 10 years. I had nothing else but my ears to tell me if I was off key or not (I don't know if some of you are familiar with brass instruments? But basically the same fingering can but used to make different notes of different pitch... The only thing changing the pitch was the pressure on the lips of the players... But I digress...) My point is : my ears are my tools and I need to trust them (that and of course my Yamaha HS-50 and HS-10)

2nd- Mixing seems to be the key here. And it makes a lot of sense too. That advice, I'll keep

3rd- Not making my own mastering also sounds like a great advice. When you're caught to much in something, sometimes we loose perspective... And that can lead to disaster... The question then is not : Why does my music doesn't sounds as loud as other music? The question is : Is this track worthy of being mastered by a professional? And unfortunately, although I could get good advice from people, I cannot get a straight answer like to a technical question... It's subjective and a matter of taste...

4th- No Live intro doesn't have the limiter plug-in. I'll have to look for some third party... If anyone knows one, please step forward

Again thanks every one

P.

[Rave]

Send me a snippet or the whole track and I will let you know if it is worthy of mastering - i won't charge.

[Rave]

I cant afford external mastering. Cheers for the comments though.

Not even 15 USD? FYI I can master well enough to get you on Beatport.

[Tone Deft]

@shameless whoring.

it'd be worth it funken, you can get a set back and see how someone with experience would handle your own track. that's far more interesting than reading a tutorial of someone tweaking their own stuff. it'd be great bang for the buck as far as learning production goes.

[The Carpet Cleaner]

my attempt at loud

http://soundcloud.com/kenny-da-funk/del ... ny-da-funk

not bad funken, I can hear you pushed the drums louder to increase the dynamic range