ableton orchestral essentials

[theophilus]

wish this would have come out a year or two ago:

http://www.ableton.com/library/orchestr ... essentials

not bad for $99. demos sound pretty good, but it's only 900 megs? hard to believe they can fit it in.
i mean, my pop/rock strings collection is like 5GB, and it isn't just ensembles but still.
wish they would show some pictures of what macros you get as well, or a list of instruments.
also wonder what's missing from the 'full' orchestra essentials (which is 5GB and ~$300).

[botstein]

Read the fine (and not-so-fine) print before buying. I have the Orchestral Instruments Collection, which I like, but isn't perfect. For example, there is inexplicably no trombone solo samples, despite there being solo and section samples of every other instrument, including bass trombone.

[crystalmsc]

not bad for $99. demos sound pretty good, but it's only 900 megs? hard to believe they can fit it in.
i mean, my pop/rock strings collection is like 5GB, and it isn't just ensembles but still.
wish they would show some pictures of what macros you get as well, or a list of instruments.
also wonder what's missing from the 'full' orchestra essentials (which is 5GB and ~$300).

Exactly my questions too..this is the direct answers from ProjectSAM:
"The Ableton Pack OEE simply contains a lot less instruments and sounds than ProjectSAM Orchestral Essentials.
OEE only covers strings, brass and woodwinds, whereas OE also includes percussion, keyboards, harp, sound design and full orchestra recordings. Also, for example, OEE only offers 1 or 2 dynamic layers per articulation and no round robin alternation. OE offers more dynamic layers, has round robin alternation for almost all short samples and contains loads more special effect samples with clusters, stabs, textures and hits.

The sound quality of both products is exactly the same.

Also worth noting is that OEE is all Close Microphones. OEE uses mostly Stage Microphones (a more 'cinematic sounding' mic setup)."

ARTICULATION LIST

String Section
Sustain
Staccato
Spiccato
Pizzicato
Tremolo
Effects
Low staccato with piano

Brass Section
Sustain
Staccato
Effects
Low sustain
Low staccato

Woodwind Section
Sustain
Staccato
Staccato with percussion
Effects

The above articulations are offered as 31 presets.

Other specs
Library size: 900 MB
1 or 2 Dynamic layers
No round robin
Microphone set: stereo close mics
Compatibility: Ableton Live 8.2.2 and up

[ark]

This product seems to be similar in spirit to Garritan Instant Orchestra. If you look at their page, they are quite forthright about explaining the difference between that product and a more conventional orchestral sample library, such as Garritan Personal Orchestra, which the same company sells for the same price.

[mholloway]

From the product description: "Contents: 31 Presets"

900mb, 31 "presets" (funny they don't say Instrument Racks as usual, huh..)

for 99 bucks those better be 31 damn amazing presets! It strikes me as very lazy, silly and possibly deceptive that they won't give any further info in their shop about what, exactly, those meager 31 presets actually consist of.

If this is the new trend for the Ableton Library, then I am disapoint. To say the least. Yes, I see the list above that somebody got from ProjectSAM themselves; but I'm saddened that Ableton are pulling the "sell it for a hundred bucks and tell them nothing about it" approach in their store. Just an effin link to that info was a bit more than in order...

-M

[HeadrickProductions]

If this is the new trend for the Ableton Library, then I am disapoint. To say the least. Yes, I see the list above that somebody got from ProjectSAM themselves; but I'm saddened that Ableton are pulling the "sell it for a hundred bucks and tell them nothing about it" approach in their store. Just an effin link to that info was a bit more than in order...

-M

they got to make some cash somehow so they can keep workin on 9. I wouldn't buy it, but then again I just like live the program and none of the instruments in suite, the presets, or samples they bundle with live.

[jrathkopf]

yes, sketchy not to include what instruments in patches/presets.

Especially if it doesn't include harp: even though it sound like there is one in one of the demo songs?

[kitekrazy]

At least it doesn't require you to have the bloated version of Live to use it. ProjectSam has nice libraries. Orchestra Brass Classic is something I've wanted for a long time.

[mannheimguitar]

I am pretty confused now. Was about to buy Abletons OIC spending €499,-. Now OEE from ProjectSAM shows up for €79,-. What exactly is the difference and is it really worth now going for Abletons OIC?

[fishmonkey]

a couple of months ago you could have picked up the 70+ GB Kirk Hunter Diamond Orchestra for $149...

[shuutobi]

But in order to use that to its fullest extent you would need a 64bit DAW and 24GB ram etc.

[Pieterrr]

a couple of months ago you could have picked up the 70+ GB Kirk Hunter Diamond Orchestra for $149...

when did that happen? just checked those samples... sounds great!

[fishmonkey]

a couple of months ago you could have picked up the 70+ GB Kirk Hunter Diamond Orchestra for $149...

when did that happen? just checked those samples... sounds great!

the group buy went down to 75% off (you do need Kontakt for some of the higher end libraries though):

http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=171298

[mannheimguitar]

I just love the integration of Lives instruments though. Fits perfectly to my workflow and does not clutter up my screen. I am barely using any VST or AU Plugins any more. Since i am working on music that includes orchestral instruments especially strings i am interested in the OIC from Ableton and would even spend that amount of money. If i knew that the OEE from ProjectSAM includes the same instruments with the same quality, uses way less hard drive space and costs way less than OIC i would go for that. Integrates just as well into Live. Did anybody buy it or way better, does anybody have the OEE as well as the OIC and can compare the two?

[theophilus]

I am not sure I would go with OIC, though OEE may make sense for many people. Especially if it doesn't just come with patches, but with some string runs as well (think NI's animator presets).

as far as differences... well, OIC is a 24 GB library; OEE is <1GB. that should give you an idea of the difference in quality. part of this is because OEE appears to be only ensembles (i.e. the 'strings' patch will have violin, viola, cello, and bass all together), whereas OIC is ensembles, separate instrument sections, and solo patches. Even OIC only has so-called 'full' sections and solo though; no half or quarter sections afaik. You may not need the whole OIC though; you can get just the strings for ~190 if that works for you (add wivi band for $99 for nice sounding basic woods/brass... incidentally, it's still $99 for a few more days iirc if anyone is interested...)

if I didn't have any orchestral stuff already (i have some kirk hunter stuff, and wivi sax and woodwinds...) i'd probably jump on it. If you just need 'strings' for a rock or dance piece, it's perfect. there might not even be much else like it, and it's integrated into live's workflow. It's probably closest to NI Session Strings (original, and about the same price); SS is a little larger, but only strings. It's also in the same price range as GPO and miroslav (they are a little more, but you can get discounts sometimes), which would be a more complete orchestra with sections and everything, but (if we trust the ad copy those won't be as easy to use as OEE, and won't be integrated into live.

if you have EIC, you have some OIC patches and can try them out for sound quality. However, modern orchestral libraries, the really high quality ones (in fact, this isn't really an orchestral thing I don't think, but a real instrument emulation thing) tend to use a lot of scripting for the legatos, round robins, etc. Live can do the round-robins; i've seen that in Session Drums. However, there's no way in Live, even if you wanted to, to do the sort of scripting for legatos, intervals, etc. that are done in things like LASS or VSL or even my relatively low end kirk hunter pop/rock strings library. I think it's OK that OEE doesn't do it, after all most of its competition (like gpo/miro; not sure about ni ss) don't have any kind of scripting either, but paying $600 for a library without it seems somewhat pointless these days. The smart legato even in PRS is pretty good and makes the difference between being able to actually play strings with a keyboard (there's still room for improvement if you do some manual programming), and having to do the programming all the time.

There are lots of reasons why having a Max4Live runtime available, or having Max ship will all versions of Live, would be a good thing. But if we had an M4L runtime, then you could do the scripting in Max. As it is, even if you did, users without Max wouldn't be able to use the patches at all.