WEAK (someone prove me wrong)

[mosca]

it's all about 'buy now'

i've worked in retail for over 15years, it's all about 'me getting your cash now'

mosca

PS - i have always worked in music shops, they have to do it cos musicians are dithering, haggling, moaning, whining bitches when it comes to buying gear. The staff have to eat as well you know!

[nuperspective]

its called 'taking care of business' - get over it! i started the other thread about how there should be an upgrade offer. i had a feeling there would be, so i waited before i bought operator.

ps: i bought a novation supernova for a grand. you can pick them up now for 250 notes. the bastards. still waiting for my refund from novation.

pps: cubase V5 was 499 on release you can pick that up now for 50 notes. the bastards. still waiting for my refund from steinberg.

[LOFA]

"We have 7436 registered users"-from the main page of the forum.
Suppose that is only half the actual users, let's say 13,000 people own Live.

Well, between upgrades, bundles and academic discounts and Operators, let's say each user spent a total of 400usd. We are looking at 5,200,000usd. Now, there are 41 employees mentioned on the home page. I'll round to 40. So that comes to about 130,000usd each. However, Ableton have been around since at least four or 5 years so... Let's say 4. Now suppose that each employee got paid evenly. It looks like between 26-around 32,000 usd a year. Now I'm sure that plenty of us fanboys that have cutting edge design/programming skills and good looks would be willing to take a pay cut to work for such a pioneering, creative force, but your typical German educated programmer in the US makes a whole. lot. more. than. that!

This is why it is essential that Ableton makes deals to sell upgrades and "products," just as it is essential that their forum's are not overun by their own loayal users bickering, complaining over an occaisional, optional "Lump-sum-subscription-rate", to quote Iisack Newton, and attempt paraprashing Meffy, "walk on the shoulders of giants."

Yeah, so my attempt at Ahkums Razor is ad-hoc at best, but I think my point is clear.

I also agree that it never hurts to ask, and that something like a 15-30 day grace period is nice when it's offered or independently settled, but is it really worth all of the brain cells and emotional trauma over such trite amounts of cash? I refuse to believe for a second that anyone who can grab there stuff together long enough to save and purchase a computer that runs Live efficiently, much less the extra hardware to tweak, or even has X-hours a week to surf on a forum, can't pinch their belt a notch and just buy it! Venting is necessary though. I will give some of you that. Hell, if everyone hear wrote the crap I write...

I'm gonna go resume my lowely proletariat lifestyle now, where I get paid Shit$ an hour, but I still seem to be able to afford top of the line equipment, and all my software upgrades. EDIT- I'm referring to minor ones, and not situations like Meffy's.

[mosca]

even worse if out of the 7500 only half of them actually bought live

mo

[difference]

This is the position I am in; I already have my upgrade to Live 5 in the bag, because I unlocked live 4 recently. So I can't get the special price, because I have already got my upgrade. That's my tough shit, I won't be moaning about it.

Nah, think you should be alright man.

"This offer is good for
ALL upgrades to Live 5, including upgrades from Live versions 1 through
4 and from all lite versions."

You haven't got your upgrade to 5 yet, it isn't out mate. It's just that your upgrade (and mine) is free - obviously we would have waited for 5 to come out if that wasn't the deal, no-one buys software knowing that a new version is just a few weeks around the corner.

I can't see anything in the email that means people with a free upgrade don't get the same deal. I'd be a little bit peed off if we didn't tbh. Hope I'm not wrong!

Don't think that's the same as with people who bought the operator when it came out though. If you buy something brand spanking new, you pay top dollar for it - especially in this game; you should know that. Take Reason 3 for example - now selling for £50.00 less than it did when it came out. Most things are the same, hardware and software. RRP only applies for the first few weeks man - everyone knows that surely!

There are two reasons for this imo -

1: it's a good marketting model for the manufacturers / publishers. Sell as many as you can to people willing to pay silly money, and also create the impression that it is a expensive bit of kit, then drop the price to make it look like a bargain.

2: (and the reason why 1 works) there are benefits of getting something hot off the press - such as being able to use sounds that hardly anyone else has yet and associated "kudos" factor.

[DJRetard]

Nothing changes in this industry. Its all about show me the money.

I dont own operator and have zero sympathy for those that bought it. Get used to this type of marketing. Operator will eventually be bundled free. Thats when Ill get it.

[smutek]

meffy rules

[mike holiday]

i bought operator day 1
and have used it on every project iv attempted

i bought a 1.ghz powerbook and 31 days later they realeased a 1.3 ghz powerbook w/superdrive ( i got combo drive) for 100 bux less
pissed me off a little but i knew i had to choke on it

i don't mind giving abes cash for their art (live is art)

plus being a small busness owner i can tell you that the one thing that burns me is that people always expect something for nothing

http://www.maxinesbistro.com/

(anyone in the north looking for the best food you've ever tasted?)

[futureproof]

I agree with the man. People here are musicians, artists, DJ's, etc. etc. The only thing we ALL have in common is that we're consumers. Consumers want the best deal. PERIOD.

to a certain extent "yes", to a certain extent "no".

I personally believe in doing my best to shop at local mom and pop stores even if it means paying a dollar or five more. Just simply "wanting the best deal" is exactly the mentality that allows "anti-human" corporations like Walmart to flourish. Unfortunately i dont think most people stop and think about that.

a side note: if you ever visit Japan take a close look around. there are TONS of mom and pop stores there. They are all a bit expensive but it evens out because you earn more as well. It keeps the money flowing amongst the commoners instead of having it end up in the fat cats pocket. Japan has a HUGE middle class while in the US the middle class is disappearing.

[djadonis206]

I think everyone has a good point - including myself (thank you very much)

but get this - I sent this email to Robert Henke July 1 - he responded and is really chill but like people in retail music shops and various other places he could have said, hey you may want to wait until a little bit before the release as this email and his reply was only 14 days ago

but honestly fellas - I'm not as bitter as it may seem I'm just voiceing my opinion

it's cool but seriously though

see email

From: djadonis206
To: Robert Henke
Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 6:11 pm
Subject: Operator
Hi Robert

I'm thinking of purchasing Operator and was curious will it unlock in the Beta version of 5?

Also will I be able to use the tutorials and presets in the beta?

Please let me know as soon as you can?

Thanks


ad

[smutek]

a side note: if you ever visit Japan take a close look around. there are TONS of mom and pop stores there. They are all a bit expensive but it evens out because you earn more as well. It keeps the money flowing amongst the commoners instead of having it end up in the fat cats pocket. Japan has a HUGE middle class while in the US the middle class is disappearing.

Bravo man! Great point.

On Wal Mart, here is a great little piece by John Stewart.

Evil Wal Mart

Back on topic: I bought operator a while back. I don't think the discount is weak.