LIVE 5 great product going BAD!

Discuss music production with Ableton Live.
quandry
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Post by quandry » Sun Jul 24, 2005 7:25 pm

cane creek wrote:Powercores and UAD-1's are very popular products , you would think ableton would own these products and carry out tests before releasing a product.

He'll im the customer , i pay their wages , yet im supposed to test and then sit around for weeks waiting for solutions.

when am i supposed to get some music made.
Again, why not search the forums and see what the word is on these products in Live??? You're not paying anyone's wages by buying an upgrade, you don't own the company or stocks, and you don't write paychecks. Ableton is very repsonsive and user-friendly--if you contact them with your issues (or find answers by searching here), they will try to help, though sometimes with third-party things, there's only so much Ableton can do--I know of past issues where they definitely contact and work with third party programmers to try to make their products work properly in Live. Again, no one forced you to get 5, you can presumably still work just fine in 4 or Cubase, get some music made with those. Surely over 90% of us here don't use either powercore or UAD--have you ever tried making music without these? Can you use the effects from these as simple vsteffect plugins in Live without utilizing these hardware devices? Your system specs should allow you to use tons of effects without cpu issues--the powercore and uad seem redundant with your specs--seems like these devices are targeted at powerbooks (which we know simply don't run live nearly as efficiently as pcs) and less powerful pc laptops where people run into effect processing issues and have to get a powercore or uad to be able to handle their effect/track counts. Just a thought.

Ryan
Dell Studio XPS 8100 Windows 7 64-bit, 10 GB RAM. RME Multiface, Avalon U5 & M5, Distressor, Filter Factory, UC33e, BCR-2000, FCB1010, K-Station, Hr 824 & H120 sub, EZ Bus, V-Drums, DrumKat EZ, basses, guitars, pedals... http://www.ryan-hughes.net

supster
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Location: Orlando FL

Post by supster » Sun Jul 24, 2005 7:38 pm

why does everybody always forget that other peoples experiences do not necessarily = thier own

so they come on internet forums and bitch to the developers because theyre pissed it doesnt work on thier gear (if it doesnt) and everybody else bitches back at them for bitching (if it does)

its so predictable. it always happens after the release of anything new.

hilarious imo
.
--
NEW SPECS: Athlon 4200+ dual; A8N-SLI m/b; Win XP Home SP2; 1 GB RAM; 2x 7200 RPM HDD: 1 internal, 1 Firewire 800 (Firewire is project data drive); M-Audio Triggerfinger

josh 'vonster' von; tracks and sets
http://www.joshvon.com

amo
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Post by amo » Sun Jul 24, 2005 7:42 pm

cane creek, have you simply tried to select "same as audio buffer" for the plugins buffer size ? Have you tried turning on and off PDC ? Maybe you've said that already and I missed it by not reading carefully the whole thread. Sorry about that if the case.

Cheers,
amo
Live 5.0.3 - IBM Thinkpad R51 1.5ghz Centrino - 1,5 Go RAM - 7200 RPM 2nd HDD intern - RME Multiface - Windows XP Pro SP2

mike holiday
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Post by mike holiday » Sun Jul 24, 2005 7:53 pm

live is BAAADDDDD AAAASSSSSS !!!!!

zion15
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Post by zion15 » Sun Jul 24, 2005 8:00 pm

cane creek,

have you tried adjusting the plugin buffer settings in live5 and check out if UAD works any better with any other settings? the plugin buffer should probably be set as pretty big with DSP cards.

otherwise, i do agree that poco and uad-1 are pretty widespread and resolving any big bugs with them should be put on quite high priority. BUT if those are really the only problems you have then i don't really understand why you're making so big number out of it, what with the "we'll have to wait until v10 to get it working". i do understand that you're really frustrated but have some faith and tell the abes what's wrong - ask and you shall receive.

and quandry, the fx in those cards just might sound so damn good / special that it's not worth using native vsts instead of them. so aside processing power it's about quality and variety too... hell, uad is a pci card and all the people who i know that own it have pretty fast computers otherwise too.
supster wrote:why does everybody always forget that other peoples experiences do not necessarily = thier own
you can say that again. but it works both ways. i would hate if i had a system that live exhibited damn buggy behaviour with. i wouldn't probably go irritating and pissing other people off by accusations and ranting but i would definitely voice my problem.

i'm starting to feel like people who have working live5 setups are forgetting that there ARE people who have fucked up behaviour with l5 and they do have the right to complain and voice their concern... but i agree, that DOES NOT mean bitching and acting childishly like you were the only person in the world and knew everything.

i'm saying this for the second time in this thread and beginning to think nobody is going to read my posts unless i start thinking black/white and shouting at people: please. have some patience. have some respect for others, stop being so damn Important. remember that you're not the only one using the software, whether it works fine for you or not. report bugs, say what you think but think what you say first.
| http://www.lumeet.net/ | neverstoplovingmusic |

cane creek
Posts: 51
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 10:20 am
Location: Middlesbrough , UK
Contact:

Post by cane creek » Sun Jul 24, 2005 8:11 pm

quandry wrote:
cane creek wrote:Powercores and UAD-1's are very popular products , you would think ableton would own these products and carry out tests before releasing a product.

He'll im the customer , i pay their wages , yet im supposed to test and then sit around for weeks waiting for solutions.

when am i supposed to get some music made.
Again, why not search the forums and see what the word is on these products in Live??? You're not paying anyone's wages by buying an upgrade, you don't own the company or stocks, and you don't write paychecks. Ableton is very repsonsive and user-friendly--if you contact them with your issues (or find answers by searching here), they will try to help, though sometimes with third-party things, there's only so much Ableton can do--I know of past issues where they definitely contact and work with third party programmers to try to make their products work properly in Live. Again, no one forced you to get 5, you can presumably still work just fine in 4 or Cubase, get some music made with those. Surely over 90% of us here don't use either powercore or UAD--have you ever tried making music without these? Can you use the effects from these as simple vsteffect plugins in Live without utilizing these hardware devices? Your system specs should allow you to use tons of effects without cpu issues--the powercore and uad seem redundant with your specs--seems like these devices are targeted at powerbooks (which we know simply don't run live nearly as efficiently as pcs) and less powerful pc laptops where people run into effect processing issues and have to get a powercore or uad to be able to handle their effect/track counts. Just a thought.

Ryan
you've obviously never tried UAD-1 plugins , because if you had you wouldn't be suggesting i stop using them....

I payed alot of money for my 2 UAD-1 cards and plugins theres no way im just going to stop using them now ive heard how good they sound , you just don't get that vintage anologue sound using native plugin belive me UAD-1 plugins sound like hardware.

I'd get rid of my women before i got rid of my UAD-1 8O , as for the powercore that can go tomorrow , it sounds good but still its crap.
[url=http://www.cane%20creek.co.uk]canecreek.co.uk[/url]

supster
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Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2004 6:26 am
Location: Orlando FL

Post by supster » Sun Jul 24, 2005 8:26 pm

btw:

people that are pissed off and bitching, make sure and come back here in 6 weeks when the problem is fixed and freak out equally as much about how amazing the products is now and how wrong you were

thats the funniest part, it never fails either :lol:
.
--
NEW SPECS: Athlon 4200+ dual; A8N-SLI m/b; Win XP Home SP2; 1 GB RAM; 2x 7200 RPM HDD: 1 internal, 1 Firewire 800 (Firewire is project data drive); M-Audio Triggerfinger

josh 'vonster' von; tracks and sets
http://www.joshvon.com

cane creek
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Post by cane creek » Sun Jul 24, 2005 8:46 pm

amo wrote:cane creek, have you simply tried to select "same as audio buffer" for the plugins buffer size ? Have you tried turning on and off PDC ? Maybe you've said that already and I missed it by not reading carefully the whole thread. Sorry about that if the case.

Cheers,
amo
Thanks for the tip Amo , but being a DSP card user Buffer settings are the first thing i check.
[url=http://www.cane%20creek.co.uk]canecreek.co.uk[/url]

hambone1
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Post by hambone1 » Sun Jul 24, 2005 8:48 pm

cane creek wrote:Hey young Jedi's . I feel the force is strong in version 5

Image
Make your mind up, dude!

cane creek
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Post by cane creek » Sun Jul 24, 2005 9:00 pm

well the force was strong until i tried my UAD-1.....lol :oops:
[url=http://www.cane%20creek.co.uk]canecreek.co.uk[/url]

hambone1
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Post by hambone1 » Sun Jul 24, 2005 9:02 pm

The force is still there... be patient... :wink:

chikabee
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2005 9:32 am

Live never crash on you Huhh?

Post by chikabee » Mon Jul 25, 2005 2:42 am

i think that is an overstatement.
i had live crash on me like crazy not using any plugins
from the outside world.. Let alone the fact with some good UAD plugs

By the way their plugs are official if you don't know about them
it is probalbly because you cant grasp the concept behind them. (or afford them)
i think this thread was generated by someone like me and others
who use want to use Live more and on a high-end side
with high-gear? Who has time?

have some repect You gotta know what you talking sometime
Allot of people cant afford them - Allot of people dont know wbout them
because they still in the Matrix stuck unable to disconnect..
Some people fall off and cant keep up with technology
Some people never learn and just leave in complete darkness.

i have them but if you read this whole complete thread
again and check for my name on this forum?
i never mentioned anything about these plugs YET i own them.

i can work without these plugs besides... am a user who attempts to use Live
for it's completely creative environment one on one music making capabilities
which is what i do professionally.

Now as far as stable and never crashing? Live was never stable and always
crashed somewhere You name i can tell you in planes, trains and automobiles
Hollywood movie stars... This my little dysfuntional and irritating anomoly is true!
Live never really got these things dealt with head on - Ableton has been trying
of course..

i'am sure ableton knows this themslves for sure i'am gonna wait and see
like the original post points out mainly - we have no choice again....
and for the record ableton always gave ultimate support right?
Thats why every one here owns the product.
But i think they need to step it up a notch really
you know what i mean? we dont need more features now, Really...
We need this baby to work straight becuase i think the
people who post here are looking for that solid dependability thingy
its a feeling of functionality that lets one be free to think about creating..
and focus on that..

As for the new features they are valid and deserve a big thanks
But again what is the point of having new features if
the program is not able to help you (and work with you) on a consistant level
with some of the older versions that sometimes are better than the new ones?

With the updates and all.... it's like a man once qoted somewhere..

"Who has time!!"

"Who Has Time??"


For example to keep in their head and worry about updates..
a resolution to end the problems - or better yet a cure!!
With the tools since ableton Live 4 Yo know? ...it give you basically
everything you need for it to really be used as a self contained
program however there is two major issues

FIRST: it is not solid at all by it's self

and Second it is deffinently not solid
with outside plug's.

Now about this charade of some people saying
it it's stable and never crashing on me Maybe you
never really used the program...
And NO it is true No piece of software
program is perfect but i think people are missing the point
There are a few company with software products
that work and dont crash and pretty much let you
be consistent working out creative....
and Ableton has not yet reach that mark Yet!



Everything i own is top notch on the high-end side
i like Ableton Live i want to use Live more and
i will also say that - this piece of software is the perfect answer for
open-end all around music production...
it's design is a great accomplishment by it's self

i Hope to see the day soon when Ableton Live
is on a level where it's not the qaunity of updates
and support...

but the level of quality in the upgrades from support
quanity -vs- quality is important if - they step this up
and concentrate only on their program being right we would then
be able to say!! " Look " it is not Ableton Live's fault you have to take
it up with the manufacture buddy -> whoever makes your plug...
The Ball would never be left in their court..

Dont let my Join date fool you...
Don't temp me! But i can attest that Ableton
no version of Live never made it to that point yet
and i believe that is the view point of the original post..
Some said mature? yea Live has to get more mature (that's a good analogy)
it is becoming of age where the level of expectation is high
just because of the concept it was built on and it's overall design
and if this program never makes it to the point of
reaching it's independence day... with stability by it's self first and foremost..
All this bitching and complaining and point fingers back and forth
and people posting outrageous crazy shit talking kinda greasy
about Ableton Live? Would be silenced real quickly

For the most part i think the majority
of the people who post on this forum Love Live
but then you have your occassion sabotager's
who make statements that needs a million darts thrown at them!

How awesome Live is!

That is an understatement and allot of people will never know
because not everyone can think outside of a box creatively.

Read in between eastbubblefunk's words
dis-regard the Harsh headline that's screaming at you
like drill sergent..

12micsn1
Posts: 425
Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2004 8:07 pm
Location: Secretly looking inside Ableton HQ

Post by 12micsn1 » Mon Jul 25, 2005 4:23 am

This whole thread seems pretty trendy like a bunch of politicians who cant figure out how to collaborate on ideas to solving problems. Instead seem very blind sided an willing to make ranting speeches that lead no where to a solution. Ableton may or not be dropping the ball somewhere an need a few good people to stepup out of goodwill to help solve problems. Let me say it again, solve problems not rant on and on. People who just rant on and on add to the problem not the solution.

As a start, we need to ask Abletons or figure way among us on how we can all do our part an help. Then sitting back an letting them figure it all out. Software is what is not completely perfect can always be better. The user base is the most important source to making any product better with the proper feedback information. I know of situation with Apples Logic Pro 7 many of its users base collaborated on a improvement list an personally met with Apples representives at the winter NAMM show sometime ago. There effort paid off with the release 7.1 upgrade with alot more people feeling satisfied. Thats how it should be done then going on and on about how Live is failing somewhere.

Why can we do that here? Time to share some ideas if you want to make Live a better program to work with.

supster
Posts: 2133
Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2004 6:26 am
Location: Orlando FL

Post by supster » Mon Jul 25, 2005 4:26 am

EDIT: doublepost
--
NEW SPECS: Athlon 4200+ dual; A8N-SLI m/b; Win XP Home SP2; 1 GB RAM; 2x 7200 RPM HDD: 1 internal, 1 Firewire 800 (Firewire is project data drive); M-Audio Triggerfinger

josh 'vonster' von; tracks and sets
http://www.joshvon.com

supster
Posts: 2133
Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2004 6:26 am
Location: Orlando FL

Re: Live never crash on you Huhh?

Post by supster » Mon Jul 25, 2005 4:28 am

there's something wrong with your gear.


chikabee wrote:i think that is an overstatement.
i had live crash on me like crazy not using any plugins
from the outside world.. Let alone the fact with some good UAD plugs

By the way their plugs are official if you don't know about them
it is probalbly because you cant grasp the concept behind them. (or afford them)
i think this thread was generated by someone like me and others
who use want to use Live more and on a high-end side
with high-gear? Who has time?

have some repect You gotta know what you talking sometime
Allot of people cant afford them - Allot of people dont know wbout them
because they still in the Matrix stuck unable to disconnect..
Some people fall off and cant keep up with technology
Some people never learn and just leave in complete darkness.

i have them but if you read this whole complete thread
again and check for my name on this forum?
i never mentioned anything about these plugs YET i own them.

i can work without these plugs besides... am a user who attempts to use Live
for it's completely creative environment one on one music making capabilities
which is what i do professionally.

Now as far as stable and never crashing? Live was never stable and always
crashed somewhere You name i can tell you in planes, trains and automobiles
Hollywood movie stars... This my little dysfuntional and irritating anomoly is true!
Live never really got these things dealt with head on - Ableton has been trying
of course..

i'am sure ableton knows this themslves for sure i'am gonna wait and see
like the original post points out mainly - we have no choice again....
and for the record ableton always gave ultimate support right?
Thats why every one here owns the product.
But i think they need to step it up a notch really
you know what i mean? we dont need more features now, Really...
We need this baby to work straight becuase i think the
people who post here are looking for that solid dependability thingy
its a feeling of functionality that lets one be free to think about creating..
and focus on that..

As for the new features they are valid and deserve a big thanks
But again what is the point of having new features if
the program is not able to help you (and work with you) on a consistant level
with some of the older versions that sometimes are better than the new ones?

With the updates and all.... it's like a man once qoted somewhere..

"Who has time!!"

"Who Has Time??"


For example to keep in their head and worry about updates..
a resolution to end the problems - or better yet a cure!!
With the tools since ableton Live 4 Yo know? ...it give you basically
everything you need for it to really be used as a self contained
program however there is two major issues

FIRST: it is not solid at all by it's self

and Second it is deffinently not solid
with outside plug's.

Now about this charade of some people saying
it it's stable and never crashing on me Maybe you
never really used the program...
And NO it is true No piece of software
program is perfect but i think people are missing the point
There are a few company with software products
that work and dont crash and pretty much let you
be consistent working out creative....
and Ableton has not yet reach that mark Yet!



Everything i own is top notch on the high-end side
i like Ableton Live i want to use Live more and
i will also say that - this piece of software is the perfect answer for
open-end all around music production...
it's design is a great accomplishment by it's self

i Hope to see the day soon when Ableton Live
is on a level where it's not the qaunity of updates
and support...

but the level of quality in the upgrades from support
quanity -vs- quality is important if - they step this up
and concentrate only on their program being right we would then
be able to say!! " Look " it is not Ableton Live's fault you have to take
it up with the manufacture buddy -> whoever makes your plug...
The Ball would never be left in their court..

Dont let my Join date fool you...
Don't temp me! But i can attest that Ableton
no version of Live never made it to that point yet
and i believe that is the view point of the original post..
Some said mature? yea Live has to get more mature (that's a good analogy)
it is becoming of age where the level of expectation is high
just because of the concept it was built on and it's overall design
and if this program never makes it to the point of
reaching it's independence day... with stability by it's self first and foremost..
All this bitching and complaining and point fingers back and forth
and people posting outrageous crazy shit talking kinda greasy
about Ableton Live? Would be silenced real quickly

For the most part i think the majority
of the people who post on this forum Love Live
but then you have your occassion sabotager's
who make statements that needs a million darts thrown at them!

How awesome Live is!

That is an understatement and allot of people will never know
because not everyone can think outside of a box creatively.

Read in between eastbubblefunk's words
dis-regard the Harsh headline that's screaming at you
like drill sergent..
--
NEW SPECS: Athlon 4200+ dual; A8N-SLI m/b; Win XP Home SP2; 1 GB RAM; 2x 7200 RPM HDD: 1 internal, 1 Firewire 800 (Firewire is project data drive); M-Audio Triggerfinger

josh 'vonster' von; tracks and sets
http://www.joshvon.com

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