NEED HELP - External Compressor for setup

[markos]

Hey everyone,

I've been slowly building a hybrid system of digital and analog gear and I have to say, I am loving the workflow of outboard gear much more than just sticking to software. Lately, I've been considering the purchase of an Alesis 3630 Compressor (i've heard they are great compressors and at 99 bucks you can't go wrong). I basically want to use this at the end of my mixing stage and for mastering my music.

Here is my gear list, and how I have everything hooked up:

- Mackie 802 VLZ3
- Audio 8
- 2 x KRK 8" G2
- 1 x KRK 10" S
- Ableton Live 8.4 64 bit
- Condensor Microphone connected to Channel 1
- Guitar connected to Channel 2

So the way I have things hooked up right now are as followed starting from the soundcard:

1) Audio 8 output 1/2 to input Channel 7-8 Bal for Right Channel & input Channel 5-6 Bal for Left Channel

2) Quarter Inch to RCA's connected to Alt Output back into Audio 8 input 1/2 for recording (Basically anytime I want to record I push the Alt/Mute buttons and it records into ableton)

3) Monitor System connected to CR Room Outputs

This Mixer has one AUX as well as a ST Return so i know its possible to connect a compressor, but i am just curious to know how I should do this properly so I can use it across each channel. Also when I want to compress after my final mix down for mastering, would i just punch in ALT 5-6/7-8 to record the signal into Ableton and would this record the wet signal or the dry signal?? Do I have Pre and Post fade options here?? Also would it be more beneficial to invest in something other than a compressor to use on the Aux channel??

Any help would be great and for your reference I have attached an image of my mixer

Thanks!

[markos]

Bump

[outsidesys]

When trying to figure out this kind of stuff, it's important to remember that audio flows like a one-way street. It can't go backwards, but it can go in circles (feedback loop). Also, Mackie's manuals are excellent at describing how their mixers work, and the best practices for the various setups. I learned a lot from them myself. Highly recommended.

With that said, here are some basic options at your disposal, and which one you use would depend on the situation.

1 - Mixer Inserts
Buy 2 "Insert" audio cables, and use them on channels 1 & 2 of your Mackie (note the Insert plugs on those channels). The insert cables have a single plug on one end, and two plugs on the other. The single plug goes into the Mackie, and the other two will go into the input/output of the compressor.

This setup "inserts" the compressor into the audio stream comming into the mixer, and there is no wet/dry here - it's all wet. Use a single channel for mono, or both channels for stereo.

2 - Mixer Pre/Post, Send/Receive
Cable the Aux out to one of the inputs of your compressor, and the output of the compressor to one of the mono channels (1 or 2). You won't want to use the Stereo Return because it can't be used as a mono input. However, if you were using the Aux out to a stereo delay, reverb, or chorus, you would want to use the stereo return.

Anyway, either way allows you to blend the dry signal with that of the effect. Doing this with a compressor is called parallel (New York Style) compression.

3 - Live's External Audio Effect
If you cable the extra inputs/outputs of your sound card directly to your compressor, you can use Live's External Audio Effect. This allows you to use both of the 2 previous options, and it allows you to record/print that audio & effect together on another audio track. For example, you can drop an External Audio Effect on one of Live's Return Tracks, or your Master Track for mastering.

One last thing. For easy switching of audio cables between your outboard gear, mixer, and sound card, consider purchasing an audio patch bay. Having one makes a world of difference when trying to make quick changes.

[markos]

When trying to figure out this kind of stuff, it's important to remember that audio flows like a one-way street. It can't go backwards, but it can go in circles (feedback loop). Also, Mackie's manuals are excellent at describing how their mixers work, and the best practices for the various setups. I learned a lot from them myself. Highly recommended.

With that said, here are some basic options at your disposal, and which one you use would depend on the situation.

Hello outsidesys,

I really appreciate your response. You have given me some great information here and something I will look into. I actually pulled out the manual after I wrote this post, and it does have some great information. As a visual learner though, and a person who has specifics to how I want to work, I need a little bit more details in my answers. Hope that doesn't sound too demanding! lol

Anyways, I think i sort of understand what you have mentioned (please bare with me as I am slowly just getting into external gear).

1 - Mixer Inserts
Buy 2 "Insert" audio cables, and use them on channels 1 & 2 of your Mackie (note the Insert plugs on those channels). The insert cables have a single plug on one end, and two plugs on the other. The single plug goes into the Mackie, and the other two will go into the input/output of the compressor.

This setup "inserts" the compressor into the audio stream comming into the mixer, and there is no wet/dry here - it's all wet. Use a single channel for mono, or both channels for stereo.

From my understanding now, "insert" effects are dynamic processors such as compressors, limiters, EQ's and Gates, and "parallel" effects are delays, reverbs, choruses, phasers, and flangers. The difference of the two is mainly around the fact that an insert effect is always wet, where a parrallel effect can be controlled by the Auxillery knob. I guess my next question would be would you recommend I add the compressor to the master out of the mixer, then have the outputs of the compressor connected to the input of my soundcard? would this allow me to "master" externally and record the output of the sound back into Ableton?

Maybe i should look into getting an effects rack rather than a compressor?? Essentially I want to create an external mastering chain to the entire mix.

2 - Mixer Pre/Post, Send/Receive
Cable the Aux out to one of the inputs of your compressor, and the output of the compressor to one of the mono channels (1 or 2). You won't want to use the Stereo Return because it can't be used as a mono input. However, if you were using the Aux out to a stereo delay, reverb, or chorus, you would want to use the stereo return.

Anyway, either way allows you to blend the dry signal with that of the effect. Doing this with a compressor is called parallel (New York Style) compression.

Any tutorials on setting this up? How does it work?? Is it better to compress this way?

3 - Live's External Audio Effect
If you cable the extra inputs/outputs of your sound card directly to your compressor, you can use Live's External Audio Effect. This allows you to use both of the 2 previous options, and it allows you to record/print that audio & effect together on another audio track. For example, you can drop an External Audio Effect on one of Live's Return Tracks, or your Master Track for mastering.

Again more information, tutorials, or diagrams on this would be great.

One last thing. For easy switching of audio cables between your outboard gear, mixer, and sound card, consider purchasing an audio patch bay. Having one makes a world of difference when trying to make quick changes.

What would you recommend?? Would adding a patch bay not cause more delay in the signal?? All in all I just want to build a small external rack that I can work with outside of software. I'm more of a find one way and work with it kind of producer so patching things in and out with a mess of cables is already getting me nervous (i'm total OCD when it comes to neat, tidy, and perfecting something simple).

Thanks again for the feedback. Look forward to speaking and learning more about this!!

[markos]

anyone else have some insight on this?