Circle of Fifths Pitch Midi Effect

[Buleriachk]

How about a simple device (or addition to the existing Pitch midi device) that allows us to cycle around the Circle of Fifths instead of chromatically (by half step), perhaps allowing the l/r arrow keys (on the computer) to be locked on the device when it is in focus.

The relative major/minor should be indicated, as well as an optional (additional) mode/scale for reference. I suggest a row with at least 5 entries (Columns) (in 3 rows). An easy option would be to add a chromatic change as well (+/-) key, and to use up/down arrows to switch between Major and Relative Minor (e.g. C <--> Am), possibly with the down arrow cycling between natural, harmononic and melodic minor....

This could be conveniently synchronized with the scale matrix, for Push and/or Launchpad....

For the keys visible on the two rows (major and minor), the alphabet keys on the computer keyboard could be used to change between them; caps for major, lowercase for minor - one wouldn't even have to use the mouse or arrow keys to select the key.... (the selected key would immediately be shifted to the center column) Caps lock would set to shift always between major keys, cap lock off to shift between minor keys.

(The way I envision the device)

[re:dream]

This sounds like it could be done by an M4L device.

But how do you envisage it working? What would it do? When would you use it?

[Buleriachk]

To change keys by adding a sharp or a flat (modulation) when playing (using a secondary dominant)

For example to change key from C to G one might use the progression Dm -> D -> G, where the Dm is in the key of C major (no sharps), the D is the V chord of G major, leading to resolution on the tonic G.

Similarly, to change key from C to F, one can use the progression C -> C7 -> F, where the C major is the tonic, the C7 alters the b to a b flat and is the V chord in F, which resolves to the F tonic.

The same relationships hold for all the modes, relative major/minor, etc. The idea is to use one note as a "passing note" that changes one note to form the dominant V chord of the key to which you are moving (this is called modulation)

If interested see my .pdf (free download) on my website ("Music Theory for Flamenco), which covers classical as well as Flamenco:

http://www.flamencochuck.com/AcademyOfF ... uitar.html

[re:dream]

I know what the Circle of Fifths is. I use it all the time when mixing.
But I still don't know how you want to use it. If you want to change keys, just change keys
I still don't know what this device you want is going to do.

[Buleriachk]

I know what the Circle of Fifths is. I use it all the time when mixing.
But I still don't know how you want to use it. If you want to change keys, just change keys
I still don't know what this device you want is going to do.

One can use the matrix configuration of Push, Launchpad95, or 74 IsoControl without memorizing the positions of the black keys relative to each scale on a conventional keyboard, which allows one to take advantage of the matrix layout when changing key. To change for C to E Major on a conventional keyboard requires learning the position of the 4 sharp keys relative to the Tonic (not to mention all the chord relationships). This allows all the relationships to be preserved while using only the forms defined in the Matrix, which is a HUGE advantage.... especially in improvisation.

The matrix is like a guitar in this respect; the Co5 device would be like a capo which preserves the chord forms, emphasizing the use open strings, but allowing easy changes (relative to the capo) around the top of the Co5ths....

[re:dream]

OK gotcha. That would be quite cool

But the Push scales are already laid out in the circle of fifths.

[Buleriachk]

OK gotcha. That would be quite cool

But the Push scales are already laid out in the circle of fifths.

Not the relative minors (at least as far as I can tell) Or the modes....
(And I'm using LP95 and 74 IsoControl with Launchpad to get the matrix configurations)

And changing these scales even on Push is ANYTHING but instantaneous..... (you have to scroll through menus, etc.) This device would do it instantly using quick presses of the arrow keys....

That is, the Push doesn't allow one to configure (let alone scroll) the top two rows in Note Mode (so, for example, to set the C above Am) unless I'm missing something.

(It should also include a (momentary/lock) button to alter the note for the V chord of the relative (harmonic) minor. (e.g. from g to g# to get the E7 -> Am (V7 -> I) progression in A Harmonic Minor)

[re:dream]

OK, I understand, thank you for your patience


So. An M 4 L device? That sends scale change messages to Push? Is something like that possible?

[Buleriachk]

OK, I understand, thank you for your patience
So. An M 4 L device? That sends scale change messages to Push? Is something like that possible?

I'm working with several developers now on implementation, but I would prefer this to be a script in Live's Push and/or a Live MIDI effect.... But Live's developers don't appear to understand the use and utility of the Circle of Fifths. either in scales or harmony (try playing to a jazz chord chart in Push that uses something other than the white keys), as near as I can tell, anyway - and they certainly are not guitarists ..... Duck! Incoming Flak!