Push Pads Sensitivity Issues

[docbot]

I don't know if the unit is just a little wonkey, but is it really that hard to do drum rolls with the pads?

I tried setting the button sensitivity lower and changing the velocity curve from linear to log 5, but just can't seem to do normal drumrolls.
either the sound is quiet low and when I hit it a little harder it just all of a sudden gets very loud, but there is no inbetween (almost).

is this normal? is it really that hard to do smooth drum rolls that go from quiet to loud.


thanks!

[Logic8807]

...Well that's because you're on Log 5 if I'm not mistaken. It doesn't take as much pressure to send it to max velocity.

[panten]

It's also very dependent on what your Sampler/Simpler Velocity Settings are.

I find that if you have the Velocity in the drumRack set between 35-50%, it works well with your Push set to -10, Log3.

I can do drumrolls and subtle triplets etc nicely with these settings.

Another thing I try to do is when setting the Velocity in the drumRack I will turn on Accent on Push and manually 'normalize' the peak Output Volume in Samler/Simpler. This way I'm getting a consistent volume.

[Bin ray]

You can further mutate the response using the midi compression device

[docbot]

thanks for the tips, but is it also normal that sensitivity set to -20 to -19 does not work at all at a quiet none shaking room?
When I set it to -20 pads just start playing randomly without me doing anything. that can't be normal right?

[Bin ray]

Normal. Push warns you when you change it to -20 "WARNING: Low threshold may cause stuck pads"

[docbot]

hm okay, guess my fingers are just to feminine than. I'd probably need a setting of -25 to use it in a comfy way.

I just don't get why -20 is included at all than though, it's not as if they "may" hang.. it just starts doing whatever on that setting.

[panten]

Your fingers are not too feminine and Pad Threshold is not your problem. A setting of -17 and you should be able to blow across the pads and they'll trigger.

Your problem is getting a sweet spot combination between Push Velocity Curve, Simpler Volume < Velocity setting & Simpler Output Volume.

Try doing the settings that I suggested in my earlier post.

• Set Push Pad Threshold -10
• Set Push Velocity Curve Log 3
• If you have the Session kits load one of them up. I did it with the Punchy kit. It has Velocity set to 12, pretty low but you can still get nuances out of it.
• Try changing the Velocity to 25
• On Push, Turn on Accent.
• Whilst tapping a pad adjust the Simpler Output volume until it's peaking on your track.
• Right click on these two parameters and 'copy to siblings'.
• Remember to turn off Accent.

This is how I build all my kits from custom samples, can get some lovely grooves using Push.
If you can't get subtle variance in sound then maybe there IS something wrong with your unit.

I used to play drums on a live kit and was once described by a friend as a 'limp wristed drummer'. I more considered my style to be deft and sympathetic. So if I can bash a beat out on Push anyone can.

[docbot]

well I actually found a great way to lay down some philipp glass type stuff and might also have found a live bug by doing this.


1.) Load the Simpler Grand Piano or another good velocity sensitive synth like the M1 emu

2.) Set the pad sensitivity down to -19 or even -20

3.) Load the Midi Velocity Tool in Live and put it before the Simpler and Set it to get and change Lowest from 0 to 4 or even 1 if your
using the controller at -18 or -19 and adjust the drive. Since all the random notes are mostly between velocity level 0 and 4 they won't sound

This ways you can really play quiet gently and expressiv without having to push the buttons very hard.

For some reason though Ableton is still recording lots of random notes that don't sound .. exactly the ones with a velocity between 0 and 3 that actually should be filtered by the midi velocity device.

still quiet hard to hit 127 this way, but it plays much much nicer in my opinion (would be great if you would be able to move the compression from the middle up torwards the higher velo range, so only the top would get compressed).

in my opinion they should really incorporate this kind of midi filter setting into the push directly, so the pads stop blinking randomly from - 18 to -20.

[koranek]

One thing that I've noticed about Push is that when I play drums or melodic instruments, I can adjust things until it plays pretty expressively. But if I try to play a multi-sampled piano, it never feels quite right, no matter how much I fiddle with settings.

Playing without any sustain pedal just seems almost glitchy. Notes seem to cutoff too abruptly. When I switch over and play my Novation Impulse midi controller, it seems exactly right, so it's not the vst that I'm using. But when I switch back to the Push, it is very hard to play evenly.

For some reason I thought the transition from keyboard to Push would be easier. I really like the scale modes and the layout, so that's not it. I like that a lot. I just can't seem to get enough control over the dynamics and the sustain of notes without the sustain pedal. My performances seem too choppy.

[docbot]

I agree. I though it would allowed to be played more musical and use the full dynamic range from light touching to hitting with a little more force to acheive full velocity, but you really have to hit the pads way too hard to achieve full velocity and even at the liniar setting I never quiet can seem to hit 2/3rd of the velocity, it's either low or very high, like there's really almost only almost 2 loudness levels you can hit. But this is a problem with most pad controllers, not just push. I don't think there's any pad out there that let's you play at least almost piano style.

The trick I posted above though makes it a little easier, you can play very gentle chords by just lightly touching the pads and don't have to hit the pads hard to gain velocity. if they could filter out the midi noise on the pads from velo 0-4 that would make a truly great mode for dynamic piano, or bell type playing.

@paden
Thanks for the insight, but I really can't get subtle variance to be honest, or at least I wouldn't call it subtle.

Also is it normal that push starts playing/blinking random pads on -18 also?

[Tarekith]

Yes, it says in the manual that really low sensitivities might cause Push to self trigger notes.

[Rosko]

I've discovered my pads are not consistent, some pads seems playable others not. Often some pads not triggering at all when hit firmly. this is on -12. At -14 it self triggers from time to time.

[lyovino]

There are a lot of good points being made here and very valid ones also. I see no reason why they cannot refine this in a push firmware update. I can use push comfortably but I cannot produce anywhere near the subtleties that I can on my keys. Four instance, playing a piano patch just don't cut it… I don't know about you but watching some of the ableton gurus playing a piano Concerto makes me scratch my head, is it just me? What settings are they using?

[panten]

Rosko, I would send it back for a replacement if I were you. It sounds faulty.