What does a stone sound like?

[andydes]

If melodyne can extract the music "code" from an audio file, then the "code" must be contained in the audio in the first place.

[myrnova]

Well, I guess melodyne cannot "extract" the "music code" from sounds. It just analyzes different sounds in a geometrical (tridimensional) perspective and once done it re-codifies these sounds as "similar notes". It is different. But I am not using it, I just like the way Peter Neubaecker tried to find a solution (and that is one of the proves that music is different from sound).

[myrnova]

16/18 -> ~89%

It's the notorious "80-90%"

[stringtapper]

Since when snares and shakers are considered "musical" instruments?!

Yes there are things called "unpitched instruments" that are used to make… music.

Shocking huh?

The auxiliary percussion section of an orchestra is a prime example, but I'm guessing you've never studied instrumentation and orchestration.

[myrnova]

Since when snares and shakers are considered "musical" instruments?!

Yes there are things called "unpitched instruments" that are used to make… music.

Shocking huh?

The auxiliary percussion section of an orchestra is a prime example, but I'm guessing you've never studied instrumentation and orchestration.

They are used to make rhythmic sessions, not music. They are like handclaps. Now, you call claps "music" in America?!

[stringtapper]

They are used to make rhythmic sessions, not music.

"Rhythmic sessions"?

Do you even know what the words you're using mean?

An orchestral work with percussion is a piece of music. The percussion instruments are part of the ensemble. They contribute to the entire piece of music just like every other instrument in the orchestra.

There is a world full of percussionists, that's right not just in the US, who would laugh at your assertion that unpitched percussion instrument don't make music.

There's also a world full of musicologists and music theorists who would laugh at your entire view of music.

My guess is that at any scholarly music conference in the world your idea would get an "Aww, that's cute" kind of response, right before the room erupted in laughter.

[myrnova]

They are used to make rhythmic sessions, not music.

"Rhythmic sessions"?

Do you even know what the words you're using mean?

An orchestral work with percussion is a piece of music. The percussion instruments are part of the ensemble. They contribute to the entire piece of music just like every other instrument in the orchestra.

There is a world full of percussionists, that's right not just in the US, who would laugh at your assertion that unpitched percussion instrument don't make music.

There's also a world full of musicologists and music theorists who would laugh at your entire view of music.

My guess is that at any scholarly music conference in the world your idea would get an "Aww, that's cute" kind of response, right before the room erupted in laughter.

I just translated from italian "sessione ritmica", because I am italian, I don't speak english (I just use it, together with "google translator"). In Italy drums just underline the metric accent (accento metrico) of a melody/harmony. This element is not considered "music" in itself. The fact a piece of music played (the "sound": in italian "arrangiamento") adds battery and rhythmic elements which underline the "tempo" does not mean these are "music". Infact rhythmic elements are ininfluent in music (the "code"), unless we are talking of "accento metrico" (but this can be underlined with any object, or hands).

[crofter]

Since when snares and shakers are considered "musical" instruments?!

Yes there are things called "unpitched instruments" that are used to make… music.

Shocking huh?

The auxiliary percussion section of an orchestra is a prime example, but I'm guessing you've never studied instrumentation and orchestration.

They are used to make rhythmic sessions, not music. They are like handclaps. Now, you call claps "music" in America?!

Ha, what a fucking wanker.

[stringtapper]

So a concert snare drum solo is not a piece of music?

[myrnova]

So a concert snare drum solo is not a piece of music?

In Europe no, it is called "drum solo" or whatever. In America I guess you call it "music", because it is "played with a musical instrument" in a "musical environment", and "the result is sound", right? In this perspective, you should call, for instance... the crowd clapping hands at the end of a concert "musicians" and their hands "music instruments"? etc.

[myrnova]

In other words: this is the main difference I can notice between americans here and europeans: americans consider music "the resulting sound" (in italian: "arrangiamento". It's how you "dress" a piece of music). In Europe, on the contrary, music is more "the melodic/harmonic concept", BEFORE the sound (because music is NOT the sound or "music played": this is the american "music is sound" concept, as far as I can see, right?).

That is why, for instance, I don't consider a "cover" song "a different piece of music" only because it is played in different style, or with different instruments, with rhytmic elements added, in a different pitch etc. It remains "that" piece of music (because of its structure, which is before the sound) In America you call different song covers (of the same original song) "different music" just because they sound different, played with different instruments etc.?

[stringtapper]

So a Ghanian drum ensemble does not play music?

[re:dream]

Only to the extent that there are mathematical relationships between the frequencies and (I guess) the rhythms of the drums.

If I understand myr aright, these relationships are the music. The actual sounds are not.

In fact, the one thing that myr still has to explain to me is why, in terms of this definition of music, we need sound at all.

All we need to do is to raptly contemplate Neubäcker's 'living numbers', without the intervening complication of actual vibrations in actual air.

[andydes]

In Italy drums just underline the metric accent (accento metrico) of a melody/harmony. This element is not considered "music" in itself. The fact a piece of music played (the "sound": in italian "arrangiamento") adds battery and rhythmic elements which underline the "tempo" does not mean these are "music". Infact rhythmic elements are ininfluent in music (the "code"), unless we are talking of "accento metrico" (but this can be underlined with any object, or hands).

Try telling that to the thousands of italians who come to london for the sole purpose of clubbing in fabric.

I'm not kidding, they put their luggage in the cloakroom so they can go straight to the airport on sunday.

[myrnova]

So a Ghanian drum ensemble does not play music?

In my opinion it's music because it has chants together with rhythm, not because of its sound. The drumming sound alone is "rhytmic art", whatever. Not music (unless you call "music" in an american sense: "music is the playing sounds, drum sounds included"). Infact african traditional music is in the chants (choirs), not in its rhythm. This is called "african rhythm".

Of course, I understand you can call a drummer "a musician" because he plays an instrument in a "music environment" etc.