Footswich usable on port 2 thread

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filter_7
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Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by filter_7 » Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:28 pm

Hey, reading the release notes for Ableton 9.1 we have:

"The second footswitch input now allows to control clip recording: A single tap triggers Push's record button. A double-tap triggers Push's "New" button."

I suppose they're speaking about a sustain pedal switch, right?

The second question is about what track and clip is being armed. Anybody tried it happily?

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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by yur2die4 » Wed Dec 04, 2013 3:32 pm

It functions exactly as the Record button on Push.

I haven't tried the 'New' function yet, thanks for reminding me.


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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by filter_7 » Thu Dec 05, 2013 10:11 am

Valiumdupeuple wrote:But it has a huge latency...
do you mean only in 'new' function, or both?
do you have a sustain-type pedal?

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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by yur2die4 » Thu Dec 05, 2013 1:08 pm

After further experimentation, he's right on the latency. You can tap the pedal, and watch the button on the controller. There is a pretty good delay which is odd.

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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by filter_7 » Fri Dec 06, 2013 9:24 am

yur2die4 wrote:After further experimentation, he's right on the latency. You can tap the pedal, and watch the button on the controller. There is a pretty good delay which is odd.
Could you try if it's only a 'visual delay' of the rec light, but it's in time and smooth with no latency for the recording process?

For I think that if the set is playing and you need to record a clip, there should be no latency when we record.

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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by yur2die4 » Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:32 pm

I'm not sure of it was the switch I was using or the type of rhythm I was doing at that moment (I think I accidentally recorded a downbeat on the 2, or it was on the 1, but the bassline felt like it started on the 2), but I did get some confusing results when I tried it.

I have a lot of experience using Session View, so it should at least work half predictably. Well, what I experienced was, sometimes I'd hit the pedal, and it either would miss triggering altogether, the clip never started. And I thought it was recording, or thought it'd at least record on the next bar. Same with the second trigger. It might start recording, and I'd see it on the screen. Then I trigger again, I'd sometimes end up with an odd length of loop (strong possibility of latency), or it'd just continue recording as if I never hit it.

I experienced a lot of that frustration. Inconsistency.

I was able to fix lengths on the Push visual. But this is only after knowingly being aware of what was wrong (like, glancing at my screen and stuff)


I think I should so more tests. Like, compare it to Looper mapped to the same pedal. See if I get timing issues, or predictability issues. Like, if my looper triggers inconsistently, then it is probably my pedal at fault. If the timing for Looper is perfect, then there must be latency issues specific to Push.

Lastly, I think I can try mapping that button through another controller to see if once again there are differences in result. I know that I key map the clip record button to the / key, and have consistently good results with it.

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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by filter_7 » Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:35 pm

Let us know your results; i'm about to buy a sustain pedal 'cause for guitar recording would be useful to have 1 foot on the pedal and 2 hands on the guitar...

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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by yur2die4 » Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:10 pm

It'll probably be a bunch of hrs before I get around to it. Work and such. But I'll definitely get on it, since I'm also curious about the stability.

Of if anyone else has any experiences it'd be nice to see their results.

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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by Valiumdupeuple » Fri Dec 06, 2013 8:44 pm

Sustain oedal, simple footswitch, electric cable, whatever sends electronic contact informations...
BTW, the bug latency is a known bug reported durgin 9.1 beta... it just doesn't really seemed on their priority list 8O
BTW, if you have M4L the function is easily programmable an works as it should, but it's just a shame to have to patch faulty default behaviour to have it working well.

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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by yur2die4 » Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:11 am

So. Is the reason for the delay, the double-tapping 'New' function? That is the only thing I can imagine affecting it, imagining they'd fit a time gap in while a clip is playing for the 'New' double tapping command.

Anyway. I tried some more tests. I used the sustain pedal on my keyboard as one test, and mapping the Push controller in User Mode with the same foot switch as test 2. Test 3 will be my APC40, but that isn't currently connected.

With Test 1, the foot switch is momentary. So it has a fun kind of response haha. When you tap it once, on a blank clip slot, it'll begin recording, and continue until you tap it again. After a clip has already been made, then it ONLY records While it is held down. I kind of find that behavior to be fun...... But that's just me. Also, it loses the double-tap function. The New button is mappable on the top of the screen.

With Test 2 I went into User Mode on the Push. When in User Mode, the half-armed track is no longer armed. So when you tap the pedal, Live might begin playback, but anything you thought was armed on Push might not be recording. However, if you prefer to arm tracks on your own via mapping, that might be a strength. Still, it maps as a momentary CC, and exhibits the same exact behavior as the keyboard sustain pedal in test 1 did.

Test 2.5, before I hit Post, mapping a keyboard note to the button has the switch behavior, and still no automatic 'New' function on double tap.

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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by filter_7 » Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:14 am

@yur2die4: thanks for your tests.
In your test 1 the behavior seems correct to me: click to start, click to stop, pressed for overdub; is there a delay here in the recording?

If it's just the rec light delay there's no problem; but if there's a wrong quantization recording this is an issue. Let me know.

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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by yur2die4 » Wed Dec 11, 2013 3:43 pm

If you have a keyboard and a sustain pedal, you can try it out.

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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by filter_7 » Wed Dec 11, 2013 4:52 pm

I don't have a pedal, so this is why I'm asking.

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Re: Footswich usable on port 2 thread

Post by yur2die4 » Wed Dec 11, 2013 6:01 pm

Well, test 1 uses a keyboard input instead of Push's input.

And it does work instantly, but each time you press it, it behaves depending on the scenario, yet not in the features way that the Push input does.

When you press it, it instantly activates the session record button. Which waits based on global quantization to create a clip.

That continues recording until you tap it again.

After that, it only Overdubs while holding your foot down. It doesn't switch back and forth with each press. It has to be held down to record material over top. But there is no perceived delay at all.

It is much like mapping a qwerty key to the session record button. With the exception that a qwerty key will alternate session record modes each time you press it.

So you can experiment using the qwerty key mapping, as long as you are aware of that distinct functionality difference.

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