What do you think are the best modern dance songs? Ideally, I'm interested in songs that have a big impact, that make people want to dance. Songs where people instantly say "Yeah!". If they are also pop hits, then that's a bonus.
I ask because I want to learn modern dance song structure while being inspired. So, ideally, they have a good structure - no lame sections of filler blahness. I never go to clubs or anything, so I have no clue. I prefer modern, because I want to get up to date quick, but if some older songs are still popular in clubs, then great. I like epic sounds, e.g. the slow string section and the fast riff section in Insomnia by Faithless. I find Avicii too repetitive, but if everyone loves it, then great - he makes up for the repetition with good production.
I know there are many dance genres. Is there a CD that has a good mix of hits from each of the genres? Unlikely, but I thought I'd ask.
Also, what do you reckon is the minimum standard dance/pop structure these days?
Is there a website that features high quality reviews and analysis of dance music?
TIA.
Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
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Martin Gifford
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Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
I guess a good suggestion is to learn how to identify and discern parts and sections in popular music and dance music.
I'd start with the popular music because it is pretty standard and is used so often on almost everything that it is obvious to point out when you listen to song after song.
Even easier is doing it with the most popular top 10 country songs of the day or whatever. If you can predict section by section exactly what is going to happen, you'll have a basic understanding of structure. Then you can take it to other forms of music. Then when you try to identify sections in popular dance music, you should have some mental reference points for comparing.
I'd start with the popular music because it is pretty standard and is used so often on almost everything that it is obvious to point out when you listen to song after song.
Even easier is doing it with the most popular top 10 country songs of the day or whatever. If you can predict section by section exactly what is going to happen, you'll have a basic understanding of structure. Then you can take it to other forms of music. Then when you try to identify sections in popular dance music, you should have some mental reference points for comparing.
Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
I think some of Rihanna's big dance/pop hits are beautifully structured, and obviously hugely popular. Some are real EDM. There's a nice evolving change structure, while retaining lots of hooky repititious delish. Also plenty of dark minor chords to keep the shit dramatic.
Where Have You Been? Diamonds, Don't Stop the Music, Hard, Only Girl, Rude Boy, We Found Love are a few of my faves.
Haters will hate, but I love.
Where Have You Been? Diamonds, Don't Stop the Music, Hard, Only Girl, Rude Boy, We Found Love are a few of my faves.
Haters will hate, but I love.
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Martin Gifford
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Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
Thanks for the suggestions.
yur2die4, I understand the basics of pop structure, but dance has stuff I don't know like the "drop".
xbitz, I don't want to watch 7 hours of video. A few great current examples is what I'm looking for. I can just chuck them onto arrangement view, put locators in to label out the structure, then use that as my arrangement template.
Moosebear, I love Rihanna! Umbrella and Shut Up And Drive are my faves. Polished arrangements and production and very hooky. But I'm looking for things that are more instrumental.
Anyway, I did some research. Here's Billboard's Best Dance/ Electronic Songs of 2013:
1. HARLEM SHAKE, Baauer.
My opinion: This is laughable. I can't believe this is number 1. What am I missing?
2. GET LUCKY, Daft Punk Featuring Pharrell Williams.
My opinion: Really nice vocal sound. Retro disco sound makes it almost a novelty song. It could also be labelled a MOR song!
3. WAKE ME UP!, Avicii.
My opinion: This is country music! Is it dance because there's a repetitive synth riff and a kick on the beat? Or because it's Avicii?
4. I LOVE IT, Icona Pop Featuring Charli XCX.
My opinion: I like this, but it's pop rock. Labelled dance because of constant kick on the beat?
5. CLARITY, Zedd Featuring Foxes.
My opinion: This is a nice pop ballad, but doesn't seem to be Dance/EDM. BTW, this would have been better if the backing was silenced over the first "Why are you my clarity."
6. SCREAM & SHOUT, will.i.am & Britney Spears.
My opinion: Smoothly produced, but not a special song.
7. FEEL THIS MOMENT, Pitbull Featuring Christina Aguilera.
My opinion: This is okay. The lyric hook is a classic dance line.
8. APPLAUSE, Lady Gaga.
My opinion: Pop dance. It's good for what it is.
9. I NEED YOUR LOVE, Calvin Harris Featuring Ellie Goulding.
My opinion: This is pop dance. Generic. Too much vocal.
10. DON'T YOU WORRY CHILD, Swedish House Mafia Featuring John Martin.
My opinion: Standard dance sounds. A bit slow to get started.
Overall, these seem to be mostly pop songs. I don't feel that I could use any of them as structural templates for music that's a bit more instrumental. So I checked out Mega Dance Top 100 Best Of 2013. The first song - Animals by Martin Garrix - is one that I could use as a structural template. So far, I've listened through the first 10 songs. I'm not particularly impressed. All generic, not very musical, very repetitive.
Then I went to the trancefix forum, and there is some good electronic music there. But are those just for connoisseurs? I mean are they hits? For example, Raphael Ibanez De Garayo - Andream. That's great, but was it a hit?
BTW, it's funny how the lyrics range from youthful optimism and pseudo-drama to narcissistic grandiosity. I guess that matches the audience's age, but there must be a way to be both optimistic and inspiring yet realistic. I suppose dance musos are not expected to be great philosophers. However, studies show that IQs are improving, so maybe lyrics should improve to match that, especially when EDM lyrics often only have about 10 words. Some of the lyrics include the artists calling out their own names! Not very clever. I just heard Royals by Lorde - that's clever and musically good. It's probably a nick from Heroes by David Bowie, but everyone does that. Of course, it's not a dance song. Also, just heard, "My songs know what you did in the dark," by Fall Out Boy - that's a clever idea.
yur2die4, I understand the basics of pop structure, but dance has stuff I don't know like the "drop".
xbitz, I don't want to watch 7 hours of video. A few great current examples is what I'm looking for. I can just chuck them onto arrangement view, put locators in to label out the structure, then use that as my arrangement template.
Moosebear, I love Rihanna! Umbrella and Shut Up And Drive are my faves. Polished arrangements and production and very hooky. But I'm looking for things that are more instrumental.
Anyway, I did some research. Here's Billboard's Best Dance/ Electronic Songs of 2013:
1. HARLEM SHAKE, Baauer.
My opinion: This is laughable. I can't believe this is number 1. What am I missing?
2. GET LUCKY, Daft Punk Featuring Pharrell Williams.
My opinion: Really nice vocal sound. Retro disco sound makes it almost a novelty song. It could also be labelled a MOR song!
3. WAKE ME UP!, Avicii.
My opinion: This is country music! Is it dance because there's a repetitive synth riff and a kick on the beat? Or because it's Avicii?
4. I LOVE IT, Icona Pop Featuring Charli XCX.
My opinion: I like this, but it's pop rock. Labelled dance because of constant kick on the beat?
5. CLARITY, Zedd Featuring Foxes.
My opinion: This is a nice pop ballad, but doesn't seem to be Dance/EDM. BTW, this would have been better if the backing was silenced over the first "Why are you my clarity."
6. SCREAM & SHOUT, will.i.am & Britney Spears.
My opinion: Smoothly produced, but not a special song.
7. FEEL THIS MOMENT, Pitbull Featuring Christina Aguilera.
My opinion: This is okay. The lyric hook is a classic dance line.
8. APPLAUSE, Lady Gaga.
My opinion: Pop dance. It's good for what it is.
9. I NEED YOUR LOVE, Calvin Harris Featuring Ellie Goulding.
My opinion: This is pop dance. Generic. Too much vocal.
10. DON'T YOU WORRY CHILD, Swedish House Mafia Featuring John Martin.
My opinion: Standard dance sounds. A bit slow to get started.
Overall, these seem to be mostly pop songs. I don't feel that I could use any of them as structural templates for music that's a bit more instrumental. So I checked out Mega Dance Top 100 Best Of 2013. The first song - Animals by Martin Garrix - is one that I could use as a structural template. So far, I've listened through the first 10 songs. I'm not particularly impressed. All generic, not very musical, very repetitive.
Then I went to the trancefix forum, and there is some good electronic music there. But are those just for connoisseurs? I mean are they hits? For example, Raphael Ibanez De Garayo - Andream. That's great, but was it a hit?
BTW, it's funny how the lyrics range from youthful optimism and pseudo-drama to narcissistic grandiosity. I guess that matches the audience's age, but there must be a way to be both optimistic and inspiring yet realistic. I suppose dance musos are not expected to be great philosophers. However, studies show that IQs are improving, so maybe lyrics should improve to match that, especially when EDM lyrics often only have about 10 words. Some of the lyrics include the artists calling out their own names! Not very clever. I just heard Royals by Lorde - that's clever and musically good. It's probably a nick from Heroes by David Bowie, but everyone does that. Of course, it's not a dance song. Also, just heard, "My songs know what you did in the dark," by Fall Out Boy - that's a clever idea.
Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
The main thing I notice in all mainstream music, no matter the genre is that bit right after the choruses which is like, a representation of the band's image.
Like when you hear the words of a chorus echoed over and over for an extra bar or two or four.... Or even 8. Not being the actual full chorus anymore. Just being oh's or uh's or whatever.
Of if the image being sold is a pianist. There could be no piano in the entire song. But as long as they play a couple bars right in that part, after the choruses, they can maintain that reputation.
In electronic music I've noticed that it is the opportunity to get groovy with some weird synth.
This is not to be confused with the middle 8 / breakdown section! It is a part between choruses and verses.
In metal or rock it is the section where they wail on the guitar for just a little bit but aren't yet doing their main solo.
The abuse of that section properly can make any dance song really catchy. I mean, of course in combination with a solid chorus and a verse section that isn't a complete drag.
Like when you hear the words of a chorus echoed over and over for an extra bar or two or four.... Or even 8. Not being the actual full chorus anymore. Just being oh's or uh's or whatever.
Of if the image being sold is a pianist. There could be no piano in the entire song. But as long as they play a couple bars right in that part, after the choruses, they can maintain that reputation.
In electronic music I've noticed that it is the opportunity to get groovy with some weird synth.
This is not to be confused with the middle 8 / breakdown section! It is a part between choruses and verses.
In metal or rock it is the section where they wail on the guitar for just a little bit but aren't yet doing their main solo.
The abuse of that section properly can make any dance song really catchy. I mean, of course in combination with a solid chorus and a verse section that isn't a complete drag.
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Breaks Dude
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Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
Big fan of Calvin Harris "Sweet Nothings". Personally I think that's one of the better pop-EDM tracks out there. There's very little I don't like about it.
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Martin Gifford
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Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
Just had a listen to Sweet Nothing. Yeah, it's good. Polished. I'd just reduce the vocal in the first minute. Maybe put in a Thloop kind of build sound in there somewhere to give it a rest or to delay the first chorus a bit. Diving straight into the vocal is very different to the usual EDM structure.
Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
Big in the UK at the moment (and for a while) are artists such as Disclosure.
Examples:
Jessie Ware - Running (Disclosure remix)
Disclosure - Latch (ft Sam Smith)
Disclosure - White Noise (ft Aluna Francis)
Other names/tracks to search out:
Blonde
Bondax
Eton Messy
Applebottom
Storm Queen - Look Right Through (MK remix)
Naughty Boy - La La La
Ben Pearce - What I Might Do
Chris Malinchak - So Good To Me
Examples:
Jessie Ware - Running (Disclosure remix)
Disclosure - Latch (ft Sam Smith)
Disclosure - White Noise (ft Aluna Francis)
Other names/tracks to search out:
Blonde
Bondax
Eton Messy
Applebottom
Storm Queen - Look Right Through (MK remix)
Naughty Boy - La La La
Ben Pearce - What I Might Do
Chris Malinchak - So Good To Me
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Martin Gifford
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- Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2010 12:48 am
Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
102455,
Thanks for that list. I listened to Disclosure and a few of the others. I think I'm hearing Sylenth everywhere! It's got a great round plasticky warm sound.
I'm clueless about EDM genres. Those Disclosure songs would be called "chilled" tracks, wouldn't they? Generally, I like something more dramatic and I'm looking for less vocals, but I can still use those songs as templates and creative stimulants, so thanks again.
Thanks for that list. I listened to Disclosure and a few of the others. I think I'm hearing Sylenth everywhere! It's got a great round plasticky warm sound.
I'm clueless about EDM genres. Those Disclosure songs would be called "chilled" tracks, wouldn't they? Generally, I like something more dramatic and I'm looking for less vocals, but I can still use those songs as templates and creative stimulants, so thanks again.
Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
Definitely a bit dated now, but I always thought Hybrid were masters at arranging songs, especially the newer stuf where they teamed up with Harry Gregson Williams.
tarekith
https://tarekith.com
https://tarekith.com
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Buleriachk
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Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
Creating a coherent music structure in Ableton/Push is very difficult without a dominant 7th chord....
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Martin Gifford
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Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
Tarekith,
Do you reckon Hybrid's song structures are dated for EDM, or is it just their sound that's dated? The main thing for me is to get a good EDM structure for dramatic, mostly instrumental, EDM music.
Buleriachk,
Yes, dominant 7ths are good. Also suspended chords are good. Music theory helps a lot. It can be easy to learn too, so I'm surprised that some people are resistant to it. I guess the good thing about white noise sweeps are that they can cover up lack of musical knowledge while also being very effective.
Do you reckon Hybrid's song structures are dated for EDM, or is it just their sound that's dated? The main thing for me is to get a good EDM structure for dramatic, mostly instrumental, EDM music.
Buleriachk,
Yes, dominant 7ths are good. Also suspended chords are good. Music theory helps a lot. It can be easy to learn too, so I'm surprised that some people are resistant to it. I guess the good thing about white noise sweeps are that they can cover up lack of musical knowledge while also being very effective.
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Buleriachk
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Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
As I keep reminding everyone:
There is good news and bad news:
1. The good news is:
"The tools of production are at last in the hands of the workers."
2. And now, the bad news:
"The tools of production are at last in the hands of the workers."
There is good news and bad news:
1. The good news is:
"The tools of production are at last in the hands of the workers."
2. And now, the bad news:
"The tools of production are at last in the hands of the workers."
Re: Great Modern Dance Songs with Good Structure
Probably just the sound, but IMO the sound and the structure are often closely related so it's hard to say for sure. Worth checking out at least.Martin Gifford wrote:Tarekith,
Do you reckon Hybrid's song structures are dated for EDM, or is it just their sound that's dated? The main thing for me is to get a good EDM structure for dramatic, mostly instrumental, EDM music.
tarekith
https://tarekith.com
https://tarekith.com