Sitting on the Fence - Push or Maschine

[kb420]

IMO, if you are a Live user, and don't want to get bogged down with Maschines software limitations, by changing over to their software, then get Push.

If you don't mind the Maschine software, then indeed your options become more plentifull. And the Synths and Samples that come with Maschine are indeed very sweet!

Well, to be to honest, I don't want to have to deal with any other software if I can help it. I really would like to work exclusively in Live, but I just feel as though it would be foolish to not weigh the other options.

[TomViolenz]

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[kb420]

Yeah, this thread had all the options weighing one could ever want (and more!) Now it's time for you to make the decision that you feel is right for you.
All statements here by all posters (myself included) are just about what we prefer/like. This thread can (and probably will) go in an infinite circle...

I know. Like I said earlier, I skimmed through most of this thread, and I still haven't made up my mind. I'm a big fan of both products, and I think that you really can't lose with either.

[panten]

I did eventually make up my mind and went with Push (as you may have already guessed).


One thing I was definitely NOT prepared for was how fantastically hands on it feels in terms of automation be that recording it in Real-Time or Step Sequencing...

.. and it's all there in your Session View or on the Arrangement Timeline which can be tweaked or altered at any point using Push' capacitive encoders. It's a total game changer for me and means it's completely non-destructive (if I want it to be). I could be wrong but from what I gather Maschine (in Live) is a much more destructive process, meaning you have to bake to Audio a lot more.
This is fine, as I tend to end up baking to Audio at some point anyway but it happens very late in the composing stage.



I am not saying that Maschine isn't great (contrary to what some defunct users would have you believe) I still covet those devices; just not as much as I used to.


RE: 8 gigs of content, I can't comment as I don't own any of it. Is it THAT good? Is it better than any packs or samples you can get else where for cheap or free? Are those 8 gigs of samples varied or geared to producers who go for a genre? I don't want my stuff to sound like a generic DubStep act. I'm not in this game to be a famous superstar. no thanks.
I try not to use any packs dry if I can help it and re-sample what I've created anyway.




I am more than happy with my Push purchase; it's a solid, versatile, reliable device. To me it really does feel like an instrument and if that means trading in for less sounds temporarily then I'm fine with that.

good luck.



p.s. I'm going to update the original post with a more comprehensive summary.

[TomViolenz]

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[puzzlefactory]

Push is a great start to an Ableton controller. I love the step sequencer and the Elektron style step automation. The scaled keyboard is fantastic too. But IMO there's still a long way to go with it.

For starters i would like full access to the Live browser, i.e load audio clips, load third party plugins, load tracks from other projects, load templates, load grouped tracks etc etc...

I would also like to be able to create instrument stacks from the controller, i.e add chains in the instrument rack as well as group tracks.

Would also like to be able control Lives arrange page with the controller too.

Like i say, Push is a great start and has a lot of potential, but it needs a few updates IMO.

[kb420]

RE: 8 gigs of content, I can't comment as I don't own any of it. Is it THAT good?

I'm also a Push fanboy by now, but yeah it's that good

I don't own either, but from what I have heard, the Maschine content does sound good.

http://www.native-instruments.com/en/pr ... d-details/

As I said before, I'm a big fan of both products, but it seems like Maschine gives you more bang for your buck.

[panten]

haha Tom, I would hardly class myself as a fanboy. I've been pretty vocal about Push short comings on multiple posts. It's certainly not perfect by any stretch of the imagination as everyone around here unanimously agrees.

In fact here, I'll update my original post with an addendum wish list of essential Push fixes needed before MKII.

[TomViolenz]

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[panten]

I think I recall having been called a Maschine Fanhole in this very thread a few month back

That wasn't me was it? I apologise if it was.
This thread has gone on for so long now it feels like other people arguing around in circles about the same stuff over and over.

Anyway I think being a fanboy doesn't do anyone any good; eventually you end up like some bastardised version of Gollum and do anything to protect your precious. One plastic drumpad controller to rule them all ffs.

[kevwestbeats]

If you already have Live 9 Suite and push, that is all you need. The more you play around with the factory conetent and blend in your own synth patches or samples the better you'll get at playing the push. Any additional synths or devices can be downloaded at maxforlive. Most of the time i start of with the bomblastic drum kits and use SPL transient designer to modify the drums.

I've been a Live Suite ever since Ableton started the Suite, and I know what it can do, but you are missing the point entirely. Maschine Mk2 and Push are the same price. One comes with absolutely no additional content, while the other comes with 8 gigs of sounds, and a few full versions of some of NI's vst instruments. When you factor in the additional content that the Mk2 comes with, it really makes Push seem like a severely over priced controller for $599. That's the point I'm trying to make. It seems like you get a lot more bang for your buck with the Mk2.

You would think that Ableton would throw in something extra, especially for people who already own the Suite.

Meh. I'm not saying you are wrong (I think Standard should be, well the standard, but how would they then justify selling that for 300 some bucks alone?!), but things are as they are. You want an awesome controller in Live, with the best step-sequencer and key/pad implementation in the industry?! There is really only one choice, no matter how many more choices you'd like to have...

IMO, if you are a Live user, and don't want to get bogged down with Maschines software limitations, by changing over to their software, then get Push.

If you don't mind the Maschine software, then indeed your options become more plentifull. And the Synths and Samples that come with Maschine are indeed very sweet!

Ableton can justify it the same way NI justifies it. Maschine Mikro for $300 comes with a very competent stand alone piece of software that allows you to work on music all you want to (mind you the only real limitations it has now are no pdc and no audio tracks). For that $300 on top of sounds you get that are licensed from some of the best drum sound designers out there you also get the Scarbee MK1 rhodes ($99) Massive ($200), Prism ($99), not
to mention that great drum synth that comes with it and the free versions of guitar rig, kontakt and reaktor (they used to sell this for $50). You get so much added value for the price of Maschine that I have to agree with KB420 and it can work like an APC in Live if you want it to.

[kb420]

You get so much added value for the price of Maschine that I have to agree with KB420

I'm wondering how long it will be before Push comes down in price. It took a while before the APC40's came down. My first one was stolen. I paid almost half price for my second one a few months ago. I'll be working soo much overtime over the next month that I won't have time to play around with some new toys any way, so I still have time before I make my final decision.

Right now, for me, the decision {Push or Mk2} is all about two things:

1.) Do I want a controller that is designed to be used specifically with Ableton Live? or.....

2.) Do I want the most bang for my buck, as far as what "extras" you get for $599?

[kevwestbeats]

You get so much added value for the price of Maschine that I have to agree with KB420

I'm wondering how long it will be before Push comes down in price. It took a while before the APC40's came down. My first one was stolen. I paid almost half price for my second one a few months ago. I'll be working soo much overtime over the next month that I won't have time to play around with some new toys any way, so I still have time before I make my final decision.

Right now, for me, the decision {Push or Mk2} is all about two things:

1.) Do I want a controller that is designed to be used specifically with Ableton Live? or.....

2.) Do I want the most bang for my buck, as far as what "extras" you get for $599?

I was using the MK2 to control Live 9 and it worked out great. I could trigger clips from scenes and transports volume levels and pans. When I wanted to step sequence I just pulled my drums up in Maschine and step sequenced there. I know a few guys who use both Push and Maschine. I am considering it myself.

[kb420]

I was using the MK2 to control Live 9 and it worked out great. I could trigger clips from scenes and transports volume levels and pans. When I wanted to step sequence I just pulled my drums up in Maschine and step sequenced there. I know a few guys who use both Push and Maschine. I am considering it myself.

I see that you have a Mk2 and you have Komplete 9. How much different is the library in Battery 4 vs the library of drum sounds in Maschine?

[panten]

Hey guys, now that the Maschine scripts are broken after the update have any of you given Stray's MXT-Live a go?

I've not heard much mention of it round here. kb420, if you do go with Maschine it might be worth checking it out if you haven't already.